Donald J. Trump | Archived 1992 Donald J. Trump Interview: The Art of the Comeback, Cashflow Management + Robert Kiyosaki Teaches the Cashflow Quadrant + Join Eric Trump & Kiyosaki At Clay Clark’s March 6-7 Workshop!

Audio Transcription

Welcome to our broadcast. Tonight we spend the hour with a man who has already left his own unique mark on the face and history of New York City. If Donald Trump is not in the news for a high-stakes deal or a controversial new development, he may be in the gossip columns with his latest relationship. But less than two years ago, the news was that the Trump empire was in trouble, and some were quick to announce that the king had lost his crown. Donald Trump some say is out to prove them wrong and is currently writing his third book which is the art of the comeback and that’s what we want to start with. Donald Trump is here and I’m pleased to have him. Welcome. Hi Charlie. Nice to have you here. It’s been a long time.

It has. We’re in New Orleans, back during the Republican convention, in a little room talking about the challenge of the Japanese at that time. Exactly right. Now here is Trump, the art of the deal, and this is Trump surviving at the top. And here is the casino journal saying, gaming’s greatest comeback. Here is, guess what, casino player, the comeback kid,

Donald Trump’s amazing turnaround. And here is New York Magazine out this week, fighting back Trump, Trump scrambles off the canvas. Bill Clinton, after the New Hampshire primary, went out front and had a press conference and he said, even though he came in second, said, I’m the comeback kid. And look what happened to Bill Clinton. If you could translate that for you, where would it be, where would it take you to?

What would be the equivalent of reaching the White House for you? Well, I think just doing what I’m doing, Charlie. You know, I’ve had a really great streak over the last year. A lot of people went down. The economy is in a horrible condition, just a deplorable condition. The politicians destroyed the economy in 1986

when they passed a tax law that just destroyed the real estate industry, which in turn destroyed the banks and the savings banks and savings and loans. And I really got very lucky in a way. I built a Taj Mahal, which everyone said that’s going to be its downfall, the Taj Mahal. It’s over a billion dollar building. And it’s turned out to be one of the best deals I’ve ever made.

It broke records for the last three months. It won over $40 million a month. No casino in history has won anywhere near that. All three of my casinos were rated four stars by the Mobile Travel Guide. And they’re the only casinos in the United States

that are so rated. So it’s really been an incredible period of six or seven months for me. And it’s really been gratifying. Now they all want to do the comeback stories and everything else and I really I think I probably care less about that than I would have maybe three or four years ago but it’s been a

it’s been a pretty good experience for me. Then how are you different than you were three or four years ago? Well I used to say and in fact I think I said in my first book that and maybe this was foolish but I really it, that someday I’d like to maybe lose everything for a period of time to see who’s loyal and who’s not loyal. And I frankly, I found out a lot of things about loyalty. Did you find out who’s loyal and not loyal?

No, I tell you what, and you can’t guess it. You can’t predict it. It’s very difficult. What hurt the most? Well, it’s a whole different scene, Charlie. I mean, we have a situation where you have everything

going, everything going perfectly. And then one day you wake up, and the world is coming to an end from the standpoint of the economy. But I just think that I’ve had a lot of luck. I’ve had a lot of friends. I’ve had a lot of good friends. And overall I’ve done really well with it. And I’m very happy about it. I read all these numbers. And this is not investigative journalism here.

We’re interested in what makes you tick, and we don’t have the resources or the manpower or the time doing a nightly show to do what somebody would do if they spent six months working on a piece about you. But you do have the brain. Help me with the numbers. Are you, do you owe $5 billion?

No, at one point I guess I owed pretty close to $5 billion, but I had assets far in excess of that Yeah, and they passed a 1986 tax law which was just absolute stupidity by the politicians And yeah, but a lot of people supported that I know I know I’m a little acre and Bill Bradley and a lot of people Bradley’s a tax reform This was the tax reform act of all time. I like Jack Kemp, too

Did he not I like Bill Bradley and I like a lot of the people that you mentioned and they didn’t really support, but Bill Bradley did very much. Yeah, Bradley was, he was… And I have to tell you, he destroyed the home building industry in the United States. He destroyed the savings and loans in the United States. The tax reform act of 86 did?

Absolutely, absolutely. What happened is incentive was taken out of the real estate industry and the industry is such a savings and loan They based on real estate and when the values went down and they plummeted they absolutely plummeted So the savings loans had billions of dollars in real estate that now all of a sudden is one half the billions of dollars But you know better than I do is that during that time, and the savings and loan crisis came about because a lot of savings and loan lent a lot of money to developers that were bad loans and should not ever have been made.

And then all of a sudden… Charlie, that’s true. That’s true. And I have to tell you, it’s 100 percent true. But a lot of that was exacerbated. A lot of loans that could have been good loans were made into bad loans because of the change,

because of the 1986 tax law change. And what that did is all of a sudden you had resolution trust and you’re paying billions and billions. In order to save $5 billion in taxes, we’re now paying trillions of dollars to save industries and save banks and save jobs. And some people have come along and made a ton of money because of the resolution trust. And some people have made a lot of money.

And some people have made a lot of money. I see why Ron Perlman the other day made a billion dollars or something. Well, I don’t know what he made, but I, I, frankly, he’s a good man. I hope he did make a lot of money. But it’s the other side. It is that people with great entrepreneurial gifts like you, get yourself extended too far. Too much debt and too much extension. And

then when, as it happened in in America, there is a business cycle. And when the economy goes up and goes down, if you get yourself extended too far and you’ve got a huge debt service, all of a sudden, push comes to shove and you find yourself in a very, very, between a rock and a hard place. And it’s that, extending yourself too far far that causes so many people

to come to ruling well i think you’re right i mean i think i’m not gonna you know not take blame for that uh… i think everybody takes blame for that because anybody that does anything the only people that don’t get in trouble the people that don’t do anything sure if you play it safe and no risk then there’s no reward i mean when i do things i built the Taj Mahal they said a billion dollar building, how can it possibly, and now it’s turned out to be tremendously successful. It takes time.

You’ve got to be able to get over the hump. Riverside South is going to be a tremendously successful… Well, let’s stop at Riverside South, though. I mean, first of all, what did you… Here is one of the arguments made about Riverside South, that you faced a huge opposition on the part of the planning commission. A lot of people who did not want to see a huge development over there.

You turned it around, and most people give you the credit for turning it around, so you end up with 9-0. How many people on the commission? I don’t remember. We had a 12-0 vote. A 12-0 vote.

How did you do it, and did you make so many concessions in doing it that it no longer is an economically viable project? Well, the only way you can talk about viability is what’s going to happen with the market. Today nothing’s viable. Okay? Today nothing is viable.

You could have the greatest piece of land in the best location in New York and nothing’s viable. When I did the Grand Hyatt Hotel, I will tell you, the hotel market was in shambles. Everybody said, Donald, you’re crazy. And I was crazy, and I did it. And all of a sudden, I got it zoned.

I started building it, and by the time it opened, it was a tremendous job. Yeah, but would it have been successful without the zoning and the abatement? No, it course you did. Absolutely. And now what we’re doing is we’re asking for certain things in order to make Riverside sales successful.

We have tremendous popularity. Every civic association virtually in New York is supporting it. But they’re supporting it because of the concessions you made in terms of subway, in terms of how much parks and all of that kind of thing. And so the question remains, can you deliver on it? The bottom line is if the market comes back, you deliver. If the market doesn’t come back, you don’t deliver.

Now maybe Clinton’s going to come up with a housing program where you’re getting subsidized housing or something in which case you do it in a different way. We’re looking to get zoning for a piece of land that’s unzoned, that’s employ no people that’s sitting there rat rotting that’s rat infested and if I get the zoning which I hope to be able to get the city desperately needs the job if the city turns around and if The economy turns around and if incentives are put back into real estate on a federal basis No, no, there’s always this but there’s been ifs and everything

I ever did when I did Trump Tower and all fairness people said I was totally crazy. It couldn’t possibly succeed. It was too big, it was too expensive, it was too everything. And it turned out to be probably the most successful condominium development ever in this country. And is it profitable? Trump Tower? Yeah. The most. I mean, it was the most successful development ever built in this country on a condominium basis. I will tell you, two years before I started construction, people thought I was totally crazy to do it. It really worked out to be fantastic. You can say the Taj Mahal, you can say Trump Plaza. I mean, so many of the jobs I do at the time I’m doing them are supposed

to be not good, and they turn out to be tremendous successes. Who makes the decision as to when you go? Is that a decision made by you or is that a decision made by the bankers? No, no, no. And are you going to parcel those projects off?

I’ll tell you what, the city is lucky to have the bankers that I have on my job because they’ve invested a lot, they have confidence in me, they have confidence in the city, and frankly they’re very lucky because otherwise it could be a war, it could be a this, it could be a that, and that would be bad for everybody. I mean I have some really great banks on this particular site and they’ve gone with me and they’ve they believe in me and and you

know I’ll tell you what it’s’s going to be, I think ultimately the decision is going to be right and it’s going to be a great success. Look, you know what they say, when you owe as much money as you did, they become your partners. Yeah, but that’s really a false statement because Reichman owed a lot more money than me and nobody’s partners with Reichman.

You know, Reichman’s in deep trouble. Are they in bankruptcy? I want to be fair to them. They are in bankruptcy and frankly they’re in you know just very deep trouble. The banks, my banks have had a great confidence in me. They know I’m good. They know I do it the best and they also know that I’m honest. And did they have a choice? Oh absolutely. They had a lot of money. They would have had. Were the assets enough there to get their loan back?

I’m not saying I would have been easy had the other route gone, but I will tell you this. I will tell you this. They absolutely had a choice and they could have gone a different route. And what’s the route they could have gone? Oh, it could have been a contentious route and that would have been bad for me would have been bad for

them they could have put you up against the wall and said you lost this money you can’t pay it back we call the tune they could have done that and I think if they did that it would have been bad for everybody including them and I think they understood that but more importantly see I found out because they would have lost money very much I think so importantly, see I found out… Bad for them because they would have lost money. Very much, I think so.

I found out a couple of things about banks. First of all, I find the banks to be very, very underrated in terms of the intelligence level, the whole thing. I mean, I have worked with the banks now very closely for a period of two years and these guys have done a fantastic job, at least as far as my stuff is concerned. I’ve done great for them and they’ve done great for me and my thing is back. I mean I believe that in six

months, in 12 months, I may be stronger than I was two years ago or three years ago. I think I will be stronger than I was two or three years ago. I would like to see an uptick in the market. I think you’re gonna have an uptick in the market. Why do you think you’ll be stronger? I mean now that I have clearly have given up equity. Very little equity. What have I given up? You know the story is that I gave up equity. What have I given up? I sold the shuttle for a lot of Well, was that a, you made more money than, you sold it for more money than you paid for or not?

No, no, no, I’ll tell you what. Because you sold it for a lot of money but didn’t sell, but sold it for less than you paid for. I reduced, no, no, no. It’s not a positive, is it? I didn’t reduce You didn’t? I actually sold it probably for more than I paid for it.

But it’s a very complex formula. If you sit down with a pencil and paper, we can maybe figure it out someday in five years because it’s a long-term deal. We don’t want to bore everybody with it. But I sold the shuttle. I got rid of a lot of personal guarantees. The Taj Mahal, I have… Personal guarantees are unsecured loans from friends or what?

No, personal guarantees being personal guarantees to banks, where I personally guarantee a piece of a loan. Basically, if you take the Atlantic City properties, I have up to 80% of the Taj Mahal. It’s the things making a fortune. Is it making a fortune? Stay with me and ask this question. Is it making a fortune or is it generating a fortune in revenue but it has a fortune plus in expenses?

No, it has a big fortune in expenses. I mean, it’s run first class. It’s a four-star hotel. Okay, but that’s important. Then how much of this in the end is net-net cash flow? I’ll give you an example. net-net cash flow, or how much is it simply that a lot of money is flowing in, but also

at the other door is a lot of money going the other way to pay for it. I mean, I’ll give you an example. We’ll have probably $80 million in interest. I think the Taj could have a cash flow of maybe $30 to $40 million after debt. That’s some cash flow. Now, that’s a great cash flow.

Now, what do I do with it? I do with the West Side Yards, I do the Riverside South, I do other things, but the Taj Mahals turned out very successfully. Trump Plaza, I own 100% of Trump Plaza. You know, there’s this misnomer that I sold this or that. I sold very little. I mean, when you think of it, I sold very little. But why didn’t your friend Greenberg from Bear Stearns say he used to own 100% of assets that were worth nothing. Now he owns 50% of things that are making a lot of money.

What happened in Atlantic City. That’s a difference. Well, there is a difference. And I own 50% of the castle. When I say I own 50%, I’m also paying much less interest because I sold 50% to bondholders. And in return for that, I got a reduction in debt,

a reduction in this, and a reduction in interest. So it’s making a lot more money. In Trump Plaza’s case in Atlantic City, I own 100% of it. And that is turning out to be fantastic. I can take your word on all of this.

By the way, Charlie, I have to tell you, because of the fact, and a big difference is and that’s why you see in all the casino Things because of the fact they want to see you as a winner because if you’re a when it means that they’re a winner Well, they don’t want to see me as a winner actually because I have to tell you when when things started going bad I was on the cover, but instead of my hands being up. I had my chin down. Okay, so nobody wants to see me be aware. Let me just stay with that image for a second. Was it embarrassing for you? No. You know, they say about you, they took his toys away.

They took his yacht away. They took his… Nobody took it away. I sold… Yeah, but I mean, did the banks put you on allowance or not? I mean, help us understand how bad it got for you and whether you were embarrassed and

whether you said wow. Well when you say embarrassed I didn’t love waking up in the morning walking out. Help us understand that. You were a guy who was the big winner and all of a sudden the paper’s full of stories that saying Trump in trouble. Trump golden boy no longer has Midas touch. You know I’ll tell you what the hardest part is and the hardest thing is and the hardest thing about life to understand in baseball if you get 15 runs in the first

inning and you don’t get any more runs you still have 15 runs at the end of the game. Well it depends on what the other guy does. Well no but generally speaking you’re gonna win that game okay you know it’s as sad as it is to say, but you’re gonna win that game. You get 15 minutes. It’s pretty well over. Ask the Atlanta Braves. Okay, I mean, we’ve seen some examples, but anyway. In life, in life, I was 15 and 0, and then I had one very bad year. Now I had a bad year, maybe it was my fault because, hey, it was a lot of people’s fault.

It was also the government’s fault. It was a lot of people’s fault. A lot of smart people. You’ll take some responsibility, though. I will. Absolutely. I have to, because I’d be a fool if I didn’t. But I have to tell you, a lot of smart people are in real deep trouble right now, and I’m not. And a lot of people, really smart people, are dead.

They’re gone. They’re buried. They’re over. time, why are they dead, buried, gone, history, and you are alive, well, and as they say, you’re coming. Before I explain that, before I explain that, I just want to say that you have 15 great years, you have one bad year, and people judge you by your last thing.

You’re only as good as your last thing. You’re only as good as your last article or what you’ve done lately. And that’s it. I mean, you take a guy like Harry Helms. I mean, the man had 50 great years. Then unfortunately he married Leona.

I mean, this was like a major mistake. BILL MOYERS Here we go again. MARSHALL GANZ He marries Leona. Poor Harry, I feel so sorry for you. Harry, get rid of her. Just leave her alone.

Find a new woman if you can, but I’ll tell you what, he marries Leona, so now all of a sudden he has a couple of bad years, to put it mildly bad years, I mean we’re talking about major … They don’t say the score is 50 to 2. No, they don’t say the score is 50 to 2. As far as they’re concerned, Harry is like this major failure, and that’s a shame, because that’s not the good record. Well, I had 15 great, then I had the one bad year, and one and a half real bad years where I had a fight.

I mean, it was a struggle. It was a survival. It was surviving at the top. I wrote the book. It was surviving at the top. And it wasn’t easy, and it wasn’t pleasant.

Did you ever think you’d lose? Did you ever lose confidence? Did you ever say, I may not get out of this? Not once? Not once. And the reason I didn’t say it is because I had to go back and do it myself. You see, I built what I built myself, and I did it by working long hours and working hard and working smart. More importantly than anything else is by using my own brain. And there was a point where I was making so much so fast and it was so easy that I almost

got bored. And it’s true. And I write about this. I mean, I’m writing about this. It’s really been an experience. I should believe you here saying, in a way, this was good because it gave me a chance

to test myself. The adversity was good because it gave me a chance to test myself. The adversity was good. It put me back and made me leaner and hungry again because everything was at stake and therefore I had to pay attention. Well, I think I’ll look at it in the future as being good. And you know, when it was happening, I had no choice. I just had to do it.

And I did it myself. And all of a sudden, I’ll give you an example. Riverside South. I’ve had Riverside South for five years. I’ve had the land for five years. I went through a succession of executives that were in charge of Riverside South. A year and a half ago, I took it over myself.

And as you say, I got a 12 to nothing vote, and you were told that I sort of did it myself. I did do it myself. I mean, you can’t believe everything you read, but I did do it largely by myself with a group of people, but I really spearheaded something that’s turned out to be, I think, going to be a great thing. I really went back to work and I really did things myself, and I think that’s why I survived

and I think maybe who knows. Let me point out a couple of other things here at this time. You lost during this period three key executives. Correct. Very tough. And friends. And friends who were running and then you went through some executives after that and

finally put your lawyer in charge down there, right? Yeah, who’s done a great job. You had a divorce. That was you were the, fair to say people were laughing at you about this divorce. And we were amused in the tabloids. I was living in New York at the time, but we were amused by it.

But at the same time, some people said, enough of this. I’m tired of reading about this kind of stuff. Oh, I would have loved to say enough. I mean, I couldn’t help it. But you were feeding the columnist who I wasn’t feeding I mean you had no conversation with all these people. You know it wasn’t a it wasn’t a feed It was a frenzy. I have to tell you and I wasn’t feeding anybody they were feeding themselves. They were making up stories

I called up one of the top people in one of the New York tabloids, and I said hey look This is ridiculous this story didn’t happen don’t put it He said, I know it didn’t happen, but Donald was selling papers like crazy. And they knew it before the story was written. They put it in anyway. And I think for 28 days in a row, I mean, you know, we talk about Woody Allen was a big story. This thing just swamped everything. It did. This swamped everything. This was the biggest of the big. It was crazy. It was out of control.

And I guess it had all the elements of a soap opera. Did it bring any satisfaction to you that during this adversity you were able to get out of the marriage at a time perhaps you gave up a lot less money than you might have imagined you would do at another time? Well, yeah. Come on, tell me the truth. I mean, a lot of, there were those people that say that I did this purposely in order

to get out of the divorce. Well, no, but there are those who said that you used that adversity as a time to say, you know, it may not ever get any better, so you better, you know, people were saying you better make your deal now. Yeah. True?

I was very happy to pay Ivana what I was supposed to pair and this is what I did pair because she, if anything happened a year ago where I went down the tubes, where I really would have ended up with nothing, she and the children would always have been taken care of and that was very important to me. I mean, at the time, don’t forget, I was being sued for $2 billion at one point. By her.

By her. Right. And that was going to be a nasty contentious suit and frankly had I had I not had I not had a glitch I would probably not be on this program right now I’d be at divorce court if you hadn’t had what if you hadn’t been down and I not Do the bucket you hadn’t bottomed out and put some pressure on her and it wasn’t a question of pressure I mean there was a point where she probably felt I wasn’t going to make it.

I mean, there was a point where a lot of people felt I wasn’t going to make it except me. Because it says Donald is back and all of this stuff about scrambles off the canvas in a sense is good for business. So therefore you’re promoting that image. You want people to believe that you’re back. I mean as an example, it’s late in the evening right now. It’s not that you’re a fantastic guy and we did this down in New Orleans, but New Orleans

was during the afternoon. It was really much more pleasant. Right now it’s late in the evening and here we are doing an interview. You know, right. Well, a heck of an interview it is. I hope we’re going to have a good time. I mean, I hope you get good ratings too. Anything for you, Joe. Exactly. But I’ll tell you what, it happens to be… More important than North… Yeah, go ahead. That’s right. It happens to be great for business. I mean, the fact that it’s coming back. Now, it would be nice if it were the other way. If you have problems, wouldn’t it be nice if everyone…

All right, but apart from all that, come on, ego. I have an ego. Of course you do. I’ve never met a successful person that doesn’t have an ego. Nor have I. Nor have I. People are driven by it. I mean, Mother Teresa has an ego. Absolutely.

You know, so you… If you’re bigger than you would ever believe. I’ve never had the pleasure. But nevertheless, I mean, part of it, you love the limelight. You love beyond the business and what it does and the whole sense of the Trump image. You like it. You like the fact that there’s security guys coming ahead of you and sweeping behind you. And there’s this adulation and women want to be with you. And wherever you go, there are flash bulbs and

and all of this kind of thing you like it I don’t mind it I don’t mind don’t mind it or I’ll tell you what I used to like it more I still like it yeah I probably would miss it if it weren’t here because you’ve grown accustomed to it as part of your maybe Maybe. I have grown… You know, it’s been sort of wild. But I also think it’s great for business.

It is great for the casino business. It’s great for the condominium business. It’s great… Hey, they just came out with a report, the Corcoran report, that Trump apartments in New York sell for more on a square foot basis, which is really the only than any apartments in New York by far. It’s not even close.

Let me talk about that. A lot of that is all of this nonsense. Let me talk about people you ought to say sorry to if there might be one is and I’m talking to one. I raised this person first, that guy in Philadelphia, you know, who they say you got fired. You remember the guy who did the Stocker analysis?

He did great. I mean, he came out. He did well. And now he’s my biggest champion. OK, but you got him fired. You can’t, you got to look back at that.

I can’t help that his firm fired him. Oh, now come on. Did they fire him because of a call from you? I have no idea. OK. I have no idea. Okay. Really, I have no idea. But don’t you have any regret for that? Perhaps. I mean, one man may have lost a job because you leaned on his…

Because he’s a tough guy, he’s a savvy guy, he’s come out great, he’s a stock analyst, and he’s now my biggest champion. He’s saying it’s the greatest comeback. In fact, he used the word brilliant, I hate to tell you this. What’s his name? His name is Marvin Ross. That’s right. He was a great critic of me and now he’s saying that this was one of the most brilliant films you’ve ever seen. So you did him a favor by getting him fired?

Well, I think in the long run, I think he’s probably doing better now than he was doing then. So you did him a favor. That’s the… Indirectly I did him a favor. I wasn’t looking it. No, I don’t regret it. Yet this guy loses jobs. No, because that’s life. You can’t look back. I don’t like to look back. No regrets then? I mean, there’s no one that you’d say, no.

No regrets. If I had it to do again, would I have done things differently? Yes. What would you have done differently? where I sold and I made a lot of money. I probably would have sold some other things. And I think I would have treated people differently. I think that, you know, some of the people that were most loyal to me are people that I didn’t think would be. Some of the people

that were least loyal to me are people that I think I would have treated them differently. I think I would have treated different groups differently. I would have wiped the floor with the guys that weren’t loyal, which I will now do, which is great. You know, I love getting even with people, but I will, I will wipe. You love getting even. Oh, absolutely. You don’t believe, you don’t believe in the eye for the eye. You do. I know you well enough. I think you do. But anyway, but.

But tell me, I mean, you, you’re going to get even with some people. Yeah, I know, if given the opportunity. If given the opportunity, I will get even with some people that were disloyal to me. I mean, I had a group of people that were disloyal. But how do you define disloyalty? They didn’t come to my aid. Well, what did they do?

They didn’t do small things. They turned their back on you? No, but they didn’t do small things that would have helped. They didn’t do large things. Give me one example. Well, I had a one man who who frankly was on the board of a company that I was selling and he it was a Tremendous sale for me. It was a great sale Was it would have been a very helpful sale and it ended up going through but one of the things is that I had a shuttle No, this was a different company company it doesn’t matter which company and it

was a great thing for me but one of the things is I had clear I had to clear the board now I only put him on that board because of the fact I thought I was doing him a favor he got some money by being a board member etc etc he contributed nothing when it came time I have five board members, when it came time to be, to removing the slate and getting all my people, everyone said, I’m leaving. Steve Ballabuck, Harvey Freeman, everyone left except this one particular person said,

I don’t want to leave. He told my people I don’t want to leave. Well, when I heard about it, I went nuts and I blasted him and all of a sudden he left. But I consider that a great act of disloyalty. I put him on that board. Now, he did leave. I mean, he did leave.

It’s a little like Andrew. I mean, Andrew ended up in favor of Riverside South, but for all I had done, I had never asked him for anything. This is a great job. This is a job that he should have been in favor. He had to do a poll in order to find out whether or not he was going to support it. But how can you get even with Andy Stein? I mean, this guy’s…

It’s not a question of getting even. I can certainly be disappointed in certain people, and I was very disappointed. Yeah, but you’ve already said, an eye for an eye. I mean, he hits see. But how could you hit him back? We’ll see. Hey, time will tell, I guess, right? Are you looking for the opportunity? No, I’m not looking. I’m just really so disappointed in him. I’m disappointed in other people.

And I was disappointed in this one man that didn’t want to get off the board. Now, he got off. Okay, but that’s he got off. He got off after being hit over the head with a cannon, okay? What was the cannon? The cannon was me. And he ended up… What was the threat, though? I mean, did you blast him in the paper and that was enough?

No, no, no. Or did you say… The threat was just sort of a… just a He gets off. Okay, he got off maybe out of fear. You owe me Donald because I’m getting off the board. Yeah and and you know it was like one of the great jokes of the century. But it ended up that he got off and the deal went through. But that doesn’t mean I have to love this particular guy. It doesn’t mean I have to

love him. I want somebody that’s loyal from the beginning, not somebody that’s loyal because they’re afraid or because they’re this or because they’re that. And I’ve had a lot of instances like that. But, and I think, you know, and again, I think the new book, and I don’t know why I’m promoting a book that’s not going to come out for three or four months. I mean, I don’t want to waste a lot of time, but I think that the most interesting aspect, that’s right, we’ll do it when you go national. That’s right. We’ll do that for the national, forget the local stuff. No, no, no, the local stuff is important. Without the local stuff, there’s no national stuff.

Right, you don’t do the second set. Exactly. But the truth is, I think the most interesting aspect of that book is the loyalty area, the loyalty chapters. I think that’s really good. You measure loyalty in terms of your own relationship with Roy Cohn. You feel like that Roy, you stuck by Roy Cohn. I do, I think I did.

And that’s true, you showed your stripes by doing that. Well, I don’t think I showed my stripes. I think, you see, I’m so loyal to people, maybe I’m loyal to a fault, but I’m so loyal to people that when somebody’s slightly disloyal to me, I look upon it as a great act of horror. Who are you going to support for mayor? Well I think David Dinkins I have to tell you has done a real good comeback. You know you talk about comebacks David Dinkins has done one hell of a comeback in the last in the last six months and you saw what happened in Los Angeles and

you saw what happened. People really like the man I mean I’ve been with him and I’ve watched him and he has really become a very popular guy. And I think he’s going to be very hard to beat in a lot of ways. Now, I have to tell you that a year and a half ago, nobody wanted to run against George Bush. It took a man from Arkansas who was the only one, you know,

virtually one of the few people who wanted to run because George Bush was unbeatable. There was no way you could beat this guy and he turned out to, you know, he just ran out of gas. It looked like David Dinkins couldn’t possibly win re-election a year ago and then you had lost a lot of other things and now he’s in a much better position to pull the seat. He’s done a great comeback. You support him over Giuliani? who I’m supporting and I don’t think it’s even relevant. I just think that Dinkins has really done a great job in terms of coming back. And I also think he’s a great human being. I think he’s a very good. He helped you on the

planning commission. He helped me but he was tough. He was strong. He was he was very community oriented. He was very much for the people in that sense. But when he gave me his word that he would now support the job, he really lived up to that word. There was also a guy on the political scene this year named Ross Perot, a billionaire. You’ve, were you once a billionaire?

I was, I don’t know, I was projected as being a billionaire a couple of times. You never can tell about those numbers. I mean, you know, a couple, because I saw that at least 900 million, but did you actually have a net worth of 2 billion? No, I guess they had me up to the highest of 2. What did you have yourself up to?

I don’t know. I had myself up to maybe what I have right now. I don’t know. Nobody knows what I’m worth. What’s the Taj Mahal worth? What’s the West Side worth?

I don’t know. I have no idea what I’m worth. What was it you used to say about the plaza? You said this is a trophy. It is a trophy. Therefore, it’s a different place if it’s a trophy. It is a trophy. It is a trophy. If it’s the best and unique, then people pay a premium for the best and unique. But people don’t buy trophies so much anymore.

Yeah, that’s true. The 1988 trophies were great. trophy? Probably. No, I’ll tell you what, when I bought the Plaza I was offered a huge profit a year after and brilliantly I decided not to take that profit. Okay. Who sold it to you? Was it the Bassets only? It was a consortium of people. The Bassets were involved? And I have to tell you truthfully, I’m very happy with my purchase of the Plaza Hotel. I think it’s working out fantastically. I think it’s going to work out. You know adversity is a very funny thing. When you have adversity it’s not it’s like in golf, it’s like in sports. Everybody, it’s a question of how many bad shots do you hit. Not so many

good shots, but how many bad shots. In other words, minimize your bad shots. You really have to, it’s not a question of getting, because everybody’s gonna get in trouble, it’s a question of how do you get out of trouble. I think the Plaza Hotel is going to turn out to be a great deal for me. I mean, it’s already turning out to be a great deal for me. But golf, that sporting metaphor may be correct, because in golf, if you were playing and you got to go over the water to reach the green, sometimes you don’t make it over the water. Sometimes you don’t.

And then it can put you into bogey land. But hey, but that’s not where I am. Although I could have. You’re not in bogey land now? Well, but are you back to par? You’re not even back to par.

You’re at least bogey land. No, I think, again, I tell you this, and I make this prediction, I think in six months I’ll be stronger than I was three or four years ago, whatever my… That’s a birdie. I believe, what I did is I restructured things in the early 90s in the bad times, and now it’s turning out to be very good. I believe that I’ll be stronger than I was two years ago, but who knows?

I mean, let’s see what happens. Let’s see what happens with the economy, let’s see what happens with the water. Ross Perot had a $3 billion, was willing to spend it and got something, I haven’t seen the last tally, maybe 17, 18 percent of the vote, 19 percent of the vote. There was a time in which you wanted to tease America that you might be, want to run for president. Well, people said that.

I never did, but people said that. You didn’t go to New Hampshire to test the water, you know, under the influence of Roger Stone say, you know, this is an interesting idea, let’s go up and see what we can do. I really went to New Hampshire because they wanted me to go to New Hampshire and they wanted me to make a speech. But you knew that your appearance there would generate the talk.

Well, I certainly did generate talk. But you knew that your appearance would generate talk. No, I didn’t do it for that reason and I had no idea how much talk would be generated and I had no intention of running for president and I wouldn’t have an intention of running for president. I will say this Ross Perot he made some monumental mistakes had he not dropped out of the election had he not make the gaffes about you know the watchdogs and the guard dogs and everybody coming at the

house and you know three or four if he didn’t have three or four bad days and they were real bad days he could have conceivably won this crazy election. You’ll get some political people who are smarter than you and I both about politics who will say the same thing. Oh I believe you. That he could have made it a very competitive race.

He was up to 42 points at one point. But at the same time whatever it is that made him generate two billion dollars, which enabled him to do as well as he did in part, in part, he was very effective in the debates and that had nothing to do with how much money he had. At the same time, maybe, you know, you have to take the good with the bad and part of the personality makeup that helped make him two billion dollars also made him the way

he is about sort of the paranoia about the paranoia maybe created some of the money but it’s not necessarily good or the drive it creates both see one of the problems with politics and politicians is that you really can’t have done very much wrong and that means you can’t have done very much because if you’re doing a lot hey I do a lot of things and most of them turn out good but some of them have to turn out bad and it’s you know they’ll hit you with a little bad and it makes it a little bit more difficult. Franklin Roosevelt I

think once said Arthur Schlesinger was here the other night and I’m not sure he said this but I think that FDR once said I’m proud of all my enemies I’ve earned them. What enemies are you proud of? Well I’m proud of having a guy like Ed Koch as an enemy because I think he’s a major loser. He did a lousy job as mayor. He’s a promoter. He’s very much of a promoter.

He did not do a good job as a mayor. He got very upset because after eight years of trying to build the Wollman Skating Rink, I was able to do it in four months for about one-tenth the money that they spent. And instead of thanking me, he took great umbrage to the fact that I was able to do this. And I just wanted to have my kids go ice skating in Central Park. I got tired of watching these people sitting on their…

I’m not allowed to say S’s in this program, so of course I won’t say. But I got tired of watching these people just sitting down and not working and not doing it right and having no planning and no leadership. So instead of thanking me and saying, Donald, that was a great job, he went around saying, well, I think we could have done it if we this, if we that. He was not… So Ed Koch, who else?

I think it was just a great guy. What other enemy are you proud of? I’m not proud of enemies. I’d like to have, you know, I’m the kind of guy that has great friends and great enemies and somehow, but I’m not proud of having enemies. Is your father still the seminal influence in your life? Well, I have a great father.

I have a wonderful father. He’s somebody I love very much. I wouldn’t say he is, I’d say my mother and father maybe is a combination. Together? Yeah, together because I have just truly been… And what way did they influence you differently?

Well, they’re very different people. My father’s a very business-oriented guy, but a very good man. I mean, if somebody came up to my father on the street and said, I need $100, I need $200. My father is the softest touch when it comes to people that really are in trouble. He’s really a very great humanitarian in that sense. But he’s a strong man.

He’s a… People would think of him as being cold, but he’s not cold at all. My mother is openly warm. I mean, she’s just a wonderful woman. Except when it comes to Mike Tyson. Except when it came to Mike Tyson.

It took 40 years, and finally she came out and she said something. But she’s a fabulous woman. She made you like yourself when you were growing up. I mean, by her love, reinforced your sense of self. She really did. I mean, she’s some woman. Greenberg again, in this New York Magazine article said about you, he said, if Donald

gives you his word, it’s good as gold. However, he said. He said that sometimes I have a bad memory. That leaves you wide open to, you know, it leaves you wide open to the fact that. And I have a photographic memory. Exactly. It raises this question, can you trust what Donald really says? Because his memory may be short.

Yeah. Now, I think he meant that jokingly. He’s a great friend and he be short. Yeah, now I think he meant that jokingly. He’s a great friend and he’s a great gentleman. And I think he meant that jokingly. I think, but perhaps he’s had some bad experiences. I really don’t know. What brings you the greatest satisfaction now?

Is it conquering adversity or is it something else? Well, I used to think just continued success but I got bored by it. Yeah, enough and enough is not enough. Enough, enough. And then I really think that right now I’m just really proud with the way I’ve handled things. I really think that I’ve handled things well from a business standpoint. And somebody who steps forward and says, you know, this is just Donald’s hype.

He’s a giant promoter. He hasn’t come back. I mean, times have turned a little bit around. You know, he’s sold off some assets, but it’s not the great comeback that he believes it is. Well, all they have to do, I mean, all they have to do you look at the numbers. And you know, it’s been a tremendous comeback. And I’m not saying I’m as far back as I will be in six months.

I mean, I’m really back and I’m not in any trouble. And I’m doing well and I’m making money. What do you think? Money is a scorecard for me. You know, money is not as important as people would think it would be to a guy like me.

But it is a scorecard. And you know, I’ve really… So what is the most important thing to a guy like you? I think the way I’ve survived, the quality in which I’ve lived under the survival mode, the image I’ve portrayed during the survival period. I mean, people haven’t seen me go into a corner and put my thumb in my mouth and say, I give up, I give up. I mean, this kid doesn’t give up.

And some people did give up, I have to tell you Charlie. And you know, you’re not going to be doing interviews with them. But some people did give up. Many people gave up. And many tough, smart killers gave up. They just gave up. They said I can’t do it anymore. So I think the way in which I survived was very important to me. Art of the Comeback, soon to be out, what, we’re going to be out in the beginning of 19… Three or four months.

Three or four months. You’re writing this alone? I’m doing this one alone because I really want to get my flavor. I’ve had two wonderful writers. My other books were both number one best sellers. I’m doing this alone.

I want to get my own flavor. It’s really become somewhat of a passion because I think people are gonna learn a lot from it. Good to have you. Have a good time. Thank you very much. Thank you. Donald Trump is back. Well the rich dad poured out I came out in I said, your house is not an asset. And it drove people nuts. It just went crazy on me, because that’s a common belief. But when you can’t make your house payments, you find out it’s the biggest liability you

got in many of the times. It’s turned out to be very much more correct than you even thought when you look at what’s happened to home prices. And Donald and I love real estate. I love real estate. I think it’s the best thing going. Better than sliced bread. But if you’re not smart with it, it’s like a loaded gun. You can protect yourself or kill yourself with it. So real estate is to me the best

vehicle. But you’ve got to be smart with it because we’re using debt and debt is a two edged sword out there. So you use debt. I use debt. But the more debt you use actually you have to be smarter so you can use debt to get richer. It can also use debt to wipe you out. So that’s why you know I continue on saying we need financial education to just say to somebody get out of debt. Well that’s not accurate. You used it don’t you. That is a great thing. And to be big and to be very successful. That is a very useful weapon. But you have to be very careful. That’s correct. So the other thing with when people say live below your means. You don’t like to live below your means to you know. And I think when you

say to somebody live below your means you wipe the spirit out. It’s like saying somebody won’t lose weight go on a starvation diet. It doesn’t make you healthier to starve yourself. So I would rather get financially educated. That’s why I read read your books because I want to. This is my greatest asset. I want to feed my brain so that I can expand my means without getting into excessive debt or where I start to lose because debt because there is a two way sort. But telling somebody to live below your means is almost inhumane. I never felt good doing it. I wanted to strive to do better every day. I want to do better every day. I like the good life. I tell the story of. Taxiing underneath your jet.

I was in my jet, but it was a little Learjet. I look up and there’s a 727, and I taxi under it. I said, holy mackerel. It’s big boys and their toys, but nonetheless it inspired me. I said, okay, I’m in a Learjet now, it’s time to step up. And it doesn’t mean the jet will make me happier.

What makes me happier is the wanting to get better, to get smarter, to do better. Well, I have a friend who was not successful at all, but was really up and coming. And he had a thing. He would only fly first class.

I’m not saying do this, because for somebody it won’t work. But he needed that mentally. He wanted to fly first class, because mentally, he wanted to think he was the best and that’s it. And even though he didn’t have much money at the time, this is years ago, he would always fly.

I used to criticize him, but it put him in a good state of mind and he became a very, very successful guy. Yes. Very, very successful. And I’ve always remembered that. He would never fly coach.

He would always fly first, last, even though he didn’t have the means to fly. So, look, it’s complicated, but whatever it takes to train that. Whatever makes you feel better about yourself, stronger, more confident, to want to do better.

And I think really that’s the issue. And we’re at the stage of our lives right now, we, you know, to ask for more is not really it. But to do better, to feel better about ourselves is still important. It is very important. Right.

So that’s why I don’t like saying live below your means and scrimp and all that because, you know, shopping is. Nice nice houses are fun. At the same time you have to be very careful. Yes. But you have to be responsible. Correct. Like you know when when you invited us up to your your little con your little duplex or whatever they call it. We walked up there and I’ve never seen a two-story, entire floor home in New York City. And my wife Kim says, you know, I never thought, I never really thought I’d live in a condo, but she says, Mr. Trump’s house will do. And

it is spectacular. You know what I mean? And it’s.. And yet I don’t need that, right? I don’t need that. If I had one nice bedroom with a good television set and a nice bed, you don’t really need that. But it was in a building I built and it was there for the taking.

So I figured I might as well do it. And what have I done? Instead of selling the equivalent of 12 or 13 units, I kept them. And by keeping them, I have them. I didn’t sell them. And that’s okay. And it’s become, you know, a very valuable place. So I didn’t need that. I don’t need it now. But there’s something nice about it. Right. And that’s my message is achieve it and then you can take it or leave it. But if you don’t achieve it then it’s always something away from you. So again that’s why I’d be redundant about this living below your means. I don’t think that makes your spirit happy. It kills your spirit. Also, if you don’t have the financial education when somebody says your house is an asset or these mutual funds are good or the stock will go up and you don’t know the difference between a good investment and a bad investment because real estate can be a bad investment, stocks can be a

bad investment. If you don’t know good investment advice from bad investment advice then you’re going to get taken. This world is not kind. Should we say the hardest thing that I’ve witnessed over the last year is seeing people that were very hardworking and very conservative that invested in the stocks. And I’m not talking about high flying stocks. I’m talking about very solid companies and their net worth is 50% of what it was a year ago and they haven’t done anything wrong. Now they put their money in stocks I guess you could say that’s wrong but it’s really not wrong because historically

that’s been okay. So they went into conservative stocks and a year later they’re worth 50% and all they’ve done is worked. And that’s the hardest thing I’ve seen. It’s tragedy. The thing that I want to say is this, you can invest in gold and lose money. You can invest in real estate and lose money. You can lose stocks and lose money. You can invest in oil and lose money. You can also make a lot of money and all those things. So really the reason we get together is because your financial intelligence your financial IQ makes

something valuable or not value. Like I said you have to know a good investment from a bad investment. Good advice from bad advice. Please take your seats. Please take your seats. Thank you. Thank you very much. In the world of business, it’s another thing my rich dad pointed out to me. In the world of business, there are four types of people. And A stands for employee. S stands for small business or specialist, B stands for big business like Bill Gates and I stands for

investor. Our school systems do a pretty good job of educating us for here so if my poor dad always said to me son, go to school so you can get a job. So that’s an employee’s mentality. Good benefits, you know, 401k retirement plan, blah, blah, blah. My mother on the other hand, and I used to argue with my dad, I don’t really want a job. And my mother would say, you know, don’t argue with your dad. You know, I said, I don’t want a job. I want to be independent. She says, why? I

said, mom, I want to be rich. My mother was a registered nurse. So she said to me, she said, son, the richest people I know are doctors. I said, yeah. So you should go to medical school and become a doctor, a specialist. You know, S stands for smart people, all this stuff. I said, Mom, there’s only one problem. She said, what’s that? Doctors are smart.

She says, you have a good point there. You shouldn’t do that. You could be anywhere doing a lot of different things but you chose to be here. Some shows don’t need a celebrity narrator to introduce the show. But this show does. In a world filled with endless opportunities, why would two men who have built 13 multi-million dollar businesses altruistically invest five hours per day

to teach you the best practice business systems and moves that you can use. Because they believe in you and they have a lot of time on their hands. They started from the bottom, now they’re here. It’s the Thrive Time Show starring the former U.S. Small Business Administration’s Entrepreneur of the Year, Clay Clark, and the entrepreneur trapped inside an optometrist’s

body, Dr. Robert Zunich. Two men, Eight kids. Co-created by two different women. Thirteen multi-million dollar businesses. We started from the bottom out here We started from the bottom out here We started from the bottom and now we’re at the top Teaching you the systems to get what we got Colton Dixon’s on the hooks, I break down the books

Z’s bringing some wisdom and the good looks As the father of five, that’s why I’m alive So if you see my wife and kids, please tell them hi. It’s the CNC up on your radio, and now 3, 2, 1, here we go! We started from the bottom, now we here. We started from the bottom, and we’ll show you how to get here.

We started from the bottom, now we here. We started from the bottom, now we here. We started from the bottom, now we here. Yes, yes, yes, and yes, Aaron Antus, you now run Oklahoma’s largest home building company, one of the largest home building companies in Oklahoma. I’m now an entrepreneur with multiple different businesses and both of us, we both read this little book called Rich Dad Poor Dad 20 some odd years ago and it changed our lives. You were in

Michigan. I was living in my mom’s basement, true story, Michigan, completely buried in debt, had no sight of how to get out. No college education, flunked out of college. And I was at an Oral Roberts University dorm room, had no idea how to achieve success, and I read this thing called the cash flow quadrant. It said we have to become a great employee,

and then we have to become self-employed. And then after that, we get to become a business owner, and then we get to become an business owner. And then we get to become an investor. So here we are, both of us are investors and we get to interview the man, the myth, the legend who created the cashflow quadrant, Robert Kiyosaki. Welcome onto this Ragtime Show. How are you, sir? Boy, you guys are already pumped up. I’m out. I moved to Oklahoma. Anyway, thank you for

the kind words. I’ve been at my old age to have young people like you saying the book changed our lives. Yeah, it’s probably the biggest spiritual juice I get. Do you know it’s because it changed my life, changed my life. I probably purchased conservatively a thousand copies of your book, given it to folks. And so I wanted to do was I wanted to tap into your wisdom on part one

about the cashflow quadrant, because we have a lot of people listening to the show that will become the future generation of entrepreneurs. If we can save capitalism in America. Sir, can you walk us through the cashflow quadrant? And I think it’s embroidered on the chair behind you.

Sure, it’s right there. There it is. Yeah. Oh yeah. But this is my etching of it. And E stands for employee, S stands for self-employed small business,

or a specialist like a doctor or a lawyer. Also stands for smart person. And then B stands for big business, according to the Internal Revenue Service. It’s 500 employees or more. But B also stands for big business, according to the Internal Revenue Service, is 500 employees or more. But B also stands for brand, like McDonald’s is a brand.

And brands are very, very valuable assets. And then I stands for investor, but it’s actually an inside investor. And so when I was a kid you know 10 years old starting with my rich dad he would walk me through this and be talking about your mindset. So on this side is my poor dad you know go to school get a job. This is he was a PhD in education.

This is my mom she wanted to become a doctor or a lawyer. And I said to my mom, the only problem with that mom is you have to be smart. She says, you’re right, guess you’re not going to be a doctor or a lawyer, because I really didn’t like school, you know. And then so my rich dad was over here and he was building a massive, massive business throughout Hawaii. So when you go to Hawaii today, if you look at Waikiki beach, you’ll see the Hyatt Regency hotel. Rich dad as an inside investor, assembled all property. And another investor took it off his

hands and built a Hyatt on it. So I watched both my poor dad and my rich dad. I watched my rich dad get richer and richer and richer. But my poor dad get poorer and poorer and poorer. Now I want to ask you this, Robert, the, you know, for somebody out there listening right now. richer. But my poor dad get poor and poor and poor. Now, I want to ask you this, Robert, the, you know, for somebody out there listening right now, if they’re an employee, okay, and let’s just because I’m going back to my 18 year old mind, I was working at Target, Applebee’s and DirecTV.

I was doing a poor job at Target, a poor job at Applebee’s and a poor job at DirecTV. And I read your book and I’m going, I have to do a good job because I need to be able to get ahead to become self-employed. What would you say to somebody who’s kind of stuck in that rut of they’re always late,

never getting things done, the perpetuating cycle of fail employee right there? What would you say of fail employee right there. What would you say to that employee right there that’s kind of stuck in that rut right now? Yeah, but it goes it goes deeper than that, you know, clay. The numbers here stand for taxes. So this is worldwide. They’re

pretty, pretty much worldwide employees pay about 40% of their income in taxes. So this is worldwide. They’re pretty, pretty much worldwide. Employees pay about 40% of their income in taxes. The small business entrepreneur pays 60%. Now when Biden wants to hire 87,000 IRS agents, he’s going after this guy. Yeah, These guys are already screwed. I mean, they take they take their taxes out before you get paid. Yeah. But these guys here, the IRS has to go after them. So the small business guy is going to get screwed by Biden. I mean, I hope I’m not Republican or Democrat. Trump is my friend. But these are the guys that are gonna go after.

So what happens to a young person, they say I’m gonna quit my job and start a business, well you move into a higher tax bracket. If you understand that thing, okay. And on this side, because you have employees, lots of employees, I only pay 20%,

but as an insider, I can pay 0% legally. You know, I don’t wanna go to a jail and become somebody’s boyfriend. You know, so I wanna be an insider all the time. So that’s my way of saying, I don’t own stocks, bonds, mutual funds, ETFs. I don’t touch anything the stock market pumps out.

I don’t trust the dollar. I don’t trust the treasury. And I definitely don’t trust government. So that’s kind of why this is so important today, especially today. And with 87,000 IRS agents coming out, you’d better get a great, great, great CPA, a tax guy.

That’s the big difference. I understand what you mean, but there’s people listening right now who have an SUV with a massive payment. They have a college degree with no actual practical skills, and they have a lot of degrees, more degrees in a thermometer, but they have no

practical skills. Could you clarify what you mean when you often say I’m bro education, I’m just anti system. Well, it goes back again to the question I was asked is what the school teach you about money. And for most people, it’s nothing. The next question is, do you think that’s a mistake? I mean, do you, I mean, do you think that’s a mistake or is it intentional?

So that’s why, you know, I talk about my book, uh, use the capitalist manifesto. This is what I care. And this is a book I wrote this year, and it’s in response to the communist manifesto. But listen to this, okay, is we were warned. I’ll say it again, in the communist manifesto by Marx, he said communism would come in two stages stage one was 1930 when Columbia university was taken over by communists and still is communist today Dennis Prager you know he calls Columbia one of the worst places you can go to and then uh so in this book here Capitalist Manifesto it says we were warned

he says this is from Nikita Khrushchev 1959 he says your children’s children will live under communism your Americans are so gullible no you won’t accept communism outright but we will keep you we will keep feeding you small doses of socialism And that’s through our schools Until you finally wake up and find you already have communism, right? We will not have to fight you We will so weaken your economy

until you fall like overripe fruit into our hands. Nikita Khrushchev, 1959. This book is nothing but quotes from Stalin, from Marx, from all these guys. But the problem is most academics like my poor dad, never read the Communist Manifesto. Do not

know they’re communists. So good. Aaron, I had a question about you know, you had a quote where you said that, you know, you really all you need for success. And I’m paraphrasing, you really all you need for success. And I’m paraphrasing, but really, all you need for success is simple math skills and some common sense. There we go. And so you know, when we my wife and I actually taking that

last quote, you just used my wife and I basically homeschooled our kids. And we did that so that they wouldn’t get indoctrinated because they’re not public schools, they’re government schools. And so we wanted to make sure they learned a love for learning so that they would continue to educate themselves after the fact because we’re very pro-education. And so we’ve created children that are like that. But what happens is, you

know, people start studying certain things. And when you go down a certain path of study, you get more and more and more specialized, which makes it harder and harder to turn into a beer and I, in my opinion. So what are the things, you know, you said common sense, which isn’t that common and simple math skills, you can be successful. What are the things that, you know,

you would spend time on studying and learning? Cause obviously you’re a lifelong learner as well. Where would you go to get the learning that you need to be successful if you’re our listeners out there? Well, that’s a great question. Again, let’s go back to book number two of the quadrant. You’re talking about the specialist. So what academics do you go to, you know, you become

a doctor, you’re a general practitioner, then you specialize, you’ve got orthopedic surgeon hearts, you know, you know you become a doctor you’re a general practitioner then you specialize you’ve got orthopedic surgeon hearts you know you just keep being more specialized but you get trapped in here and you pay the highest taxes you can’t get out so when I talk to parents and I don’t have kids so I really have not qualified to talk to him. I said, the difference is, is your child a golfer or a football player? And you see, the thing that we’re taught in the Marine Corps is Marines fight as teams. You know, when I flew in, we flew in with flights of the gunships for four gunships.

We always fought as a team. And when I talked to people who are golfers, they want to do it by themselves. There’s nothing right or wrong about it. But a golfer is here and a team player is out here. So I’m not the smartest guy, but I hire very smart specialists.

I employ these guys. My tax guy, he wrote the book, Tax-Free Wealthy’s Tom Wheelwright. I don’t pay taxes and I don’t want to become an accountant. I just called Tom up. And that’s his. He’s a specialist here. He’s the golfer. He’s actually a triathlete, which is even more nuts. But anyway, yeah, but he’s a great team player. And so in school, being a team player means you’re cheating.

I was very cooperative in school. C stands for capitalist, cooperative, all that stuff. But in school, they want you to take the test on your own. Yeah. So this is my, I asked my accountant to write this book. It’s called Tax-Free Wealth. Yeah. So this is my, I asked my accountant to write this book. It’s called Tax-Free Wealth.

Yeah. Because as I said, 87,500 IRS agents are coming after this guy here. Right. And why are they going to pick on this guy? Because they can’t afford to fight the government. Let’s talk about your gold mine for a second

and just gold in general, okay? And I’m not making this a shameless pitch for your company because I frankly haven’t researched it enough to be able to speak positively or not positively about all I can say is that I’ve looked into your career and I’ve benefited greatly from what you’ve taught me.

But years ago, Robert, I met with a gentleman who owned a bank. He owns a bank. And I sat down with him and I said, I’m doing well, I’m 25, 26 years old. I’m making good money now with my entertainment company.

What should I do with my money? And this is the owner of a bank. He said, step one, do not put your money in a bank. And I’m going, what? You own a bank. He said, I only own a bank because it allows me to borrow money that I don’t borrow money from the Federal Reserve. And he said, Clay, the Federal Reserve is not federal. There

is no reserve. So I can borrow money from the Federal Reserve that they don’t have. And I can lend it to people like you at a profit. But he said, you need to take a quarter of your cash and buy gold and silver, a quarter of your cash and buy land or property from emotional people that need to sell it. He says, look for people getting a divorce when you see the clothes burning in the lawn and someone’s yelling at their husband, get out of here. That’s when you make an offer. He said, so buy real estate from emotional people with a quarter of your cash, buy gold and silver, and then take your other half,

keep it cash on hand for your next business plan. And I thought, oh, wow. So I read the creature from Jekyll Island. I started researching the Federal Reserve and I started going, oh, wow. So I have just been buying gold and silver consistently

since that time. And I’ve seen the value of what I purchased has tripled. And I’ve been buying real estate from emotional people who need to sell it. What would you tell people out there? What should people be doing with,

let’s say they have half a million dollars of cash in the bank account. What sort of things or what mindset should people have with managing their cash? Well, first of all, I don’t give financial advice because I’m not registered to do that. And you should listen anyway. But I just

tell you what I do. I don’t trust anything that can be printed. So if you can print it, I don’t want it. So that’s why I said I own oil in the ground. I don’t own Exxon or BP or Shell. I own cattle because you can’t print cattle. I own real estate, which I use debt for, because that’s what happened in 71. The dollar came off the gold standard

and dollar became debt. But a guy like Dave Ramsey, who says live debt free, that’s good advice for 95% of the people. But if you want to use debt, you’ve got to study. And most people, as you know, are too lazy. They’re not going to study.

So that’s why I created my cashflow board game and all this stuff. This, excuse me, you gotta have a financial statement. My bankers never asked me for my report card. My bankers asked me for my financial statements. Right.

And the average person has no idea what a financial statement is because they went to school, their PhDs like my poor dad, you know, the school teachers are coming out of Columbia university, which Dennis Prager says is one of the worst schools

in America. But meanwhile, I just kind of stay off the beaten path and I invest in what the Fed and the government cannot print. It’s that simple. So I like Wagyu cattle, not because I’m a cattle guy, but I sell the semen and that’s sperm flow, cash flow. If know what I mean? You know, if the Fed could print semen,

I’d be out of that business. So I just, I only invest what they cannot print. And that’s my personal, personal strategy. Everybody should find their own strategy. I also use debt. So let’s say I have an apartment house

and I buy it for let’s say 20 million. I fix it, it goes to 40 million. Most people would flip it. Oh, I got 20 and went to 40 million. Well, if you flip it, you have a tax. It’s called capital gains. So what I do is I borrow out the equity.

So it’s like a refi. So I get a $40 million property went from 20 to 40. And let’s say I borrow 10 million out. All that debt is tax-free. And the property pays for the debt, not me. And then I reinvest in other properties.

I buy more breeding bulls. I always wanted to be a Japanese breeding bull, but I never made it. So anyway, I own the bull and I sell the semen and I get a percentage off the calf. Wow.

Now, Robert, I’m gonna pull up, final thing I wanted to do here. This is, you know, you have a lot of people in our culture today that are passive aggressive. And then there’s people like myself who are just aggressive, aggressive.

We have these things called the reawaken America tour, where, uh, your friend Kash Patel, uh, general Flynn, uh, Eric Trump, Michael and Dell, many great entrepreneurs are at these events and I’m open invitation to you. We’re doing these all across the country and what we’re doing to reassure people with people, the truth about what’s happening. And you have my promise. I will not these all across the country and what we’re doing to reassure people with

people the truth about what’s happening and you have my promise. I will not kick you off the stage. I will not ever kick you off of the event like off the lineup like Freedom Fest did to you. So if you want to join cash, I’m telling you, we’re going to Pennsylvania here. Every one of the event has what Aaron four to 5,000 people are all sold out yeah up to 10,000 and we stream to millions of people each one the biggest stream we’ve ever had was 7.1 million people streamed the Tulsa event and the average one has about 2 million people

streaming 102 streaming partners so open invitation if if you wanna join us, we’d love to have you. You can think about it, but I just wanna tell you, you’re open, you’re invited to come to any of our events. No censorship, no editing, no teleprompters. And I know Cash is joining us in Pennsylvania. So it’s my open, aggressive, aggressive invitation.

You are invited to come join us on the reawaken America tour. Should you feel the need, sir? Well, if cash is there, I mean, I only met him for about a couple of days. The man’s a stud. I mean, I was like, and cash told me we talked I just talked to cash today. I just talked to cash and I told him I told him what I bought what I’m

plotting, what I’m planning. I’m telling cash and I told him I told him what I’m plotting what I’m planning. I’m telling him and I really do believe so I prayed about it. I’ve thought about it. I’ve talked to Aaron about it behind the scenes and again each one of these events your people will be there will buy everything you could possibly sell us or and we would love to have you so again open invitation and I can talk to your team if you want to join us. We’re going to Pennsylvania have you. So again, open invitation. I can talk to your

team if you want to join us. We’re going to Pennsylvania in October. It’s almost sold out. We’d love to have you, sir. I’d be honored. You know, as the Marines would say, Semper Fi. Semper Fi. Okay, am, I’m getting worse than Biden. You know, I have no memory anymore. So I, sometimes I double book things and she kind of keeps me short.

We all need one of those. Well, sir, I’m going to give you the floor here. Final 60 seconds. People take notes. I know they’re going to go to richdad.com right now. I know they’re going to be to richdad.com right now. I know they’re going to be purchasing a copy of Capitalist Manifesto.

I know our listeners, our readers and note takers are going to buy Capitalist Manifesto. I know they’re going- If somebody out there still doesn’t own Rich Dad, Poor Dad, what are you doing? Go buy the book.

Go buy the book, come on. We just told you how much you changed our lives. So we’ll give you the final word. What would you say to all the listeners out there? Well, the most important asset you have lies between your left ear and your right ear. You know, it’s your brain or your mind, whatever you want to call it. But you’ve got to be very careful

who puts information in there. You know, is the person gonna, you know, if it was like my poor dad, I wouldn’t listen to him. And if the person is an entrepreneur and all this because I want to be an entrepreneur, I listen to the same as I was getting ready to go to Vietnam. You know, my teachers were real marine

pilots. You know, they actually came back from combat. And so I was preparing in Camp Pendleton to go to Vietnam. And I chose the instructor very carefully. I wanted to know who the best instructor was the best gunship pilot. And that guy I said just trained the heck out of me. So the most important thing is choose your teachers wisely. Yeah, I mean, very much choose your teachers wisely. There is nothing more important than this was between this year and

that year. And be careful who your friends are. You know, there’s there’s people out there who are Judas’s. Yeah. Screw you. And we know that happens a lot. Unfortunately, Robert, this was better than I possibly could have expected, sir. And I’ll tell you, the only thing that was unexpected for me,

I knew it would be good is your glasses are much more incredible than I thought they would be. You’ve got some great glasses there, sir. I have, at my age, I got to do anything. All right. Hey, thank you, brother.

We’ll be talking to you soon, okay? Thank you. I’ll be honored. I’m honored to be on the program. So thanks Cash Hull. Thanks to the Cash Hulls. All right, take care.

Bye-bye. Thank you. Inflation. Inflation. Inflation. When demand is greater than supply,

either you get shortages or you get price increases. And actually what we have is a mixture of both. We are in an inflationary spiral. 66% of people polled expect inflation to get worse. The value of the dollar since I was born has declined by 94% to 6 cents. We are about to face one of the greatest periods of uncertainty in American history.

Organize your finances, expand your knowledge, your insight as to what it is you have and then start making decisions. When people go to bh-pm.com, they can schedule a free consultation. You’re talking about going from the intangible into the tangible. If you can’t hold it in your hand, then it’s not yours. You

don’t own it. You can physically hold actual gold and silver. It ships fully insured directly to your home. Inflation rates are going to continue to rise. Don’t wait. Don’t keep putting off decisions that you know you must make. My name is Kevin Thomas and the name of our company is MultiClean. We are a commercial janitorial service and we serve the entire state of Oklahoma and Kansas and soon to be Arkansas. We have probably grown probably five times.

We’ve added, I think when we first started with you, we had 60 to 65 employees and now we have a little over 300 employees. Before we got involved with ThriveTime, we didn’t really have any systems or processes in place. I’ve probably been to, in six, seven years, I’ve probably been to 12 to 13 business conferences. Amazingly, each time I go,

I learn something new and I’m so excited to bring it back and show the team about marketing and how to help you guys implement the SEO. And the coaching is just great because there’s accountability. And it’s just a fantastic way to grow your company. Having a relationship with Thrive Time, it’s just been amazing for multi-claim.

Oh my goodness, it frees me up because then I don’t have to take a class on search engine optimization or learn marketing or shoot video. That’s not what we do. What we do is commercial janitorial service.

And you guys were the experts on marketing and you teach me and hold my hand and show me how to do it right. And therefore now my company is much, his dogs. So this guy’s like the greatest marketer you’ve ever seen, right? His entire life, Clay Clark, his entire life is marketing.

Okay, Aaron Antis, March 6th and 7th. March 6th and 7th, guess who’s coming to Tulsa, Russia? Ooh, Santa Claus? No, no, that’s March. March 6th and 7th. We’re going to be joined by Robert Kiyosaki. Robert Kiyosaki.

Best-selling author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Probably the best-selling or one of the best-selling business authors of all time. And he’s going to be joined with Eric Trump. He’ll be joined by Eric Trump. So we got Eric Trump and Robert Kiyosaki in the same place. In the same place. Aaron, why should everybody show up

to hear Robert Kiyosaki? Well you got billions of dollars of business experience between those two, not to mention many many many millions of books have been sold many many millionaires have been made from the books that have been sold by Robert Kiyosaki I happen to be one of them I learned from the man he was the inspiration that book was the inspiration for me to get the

entrepreneurial spirit as many other people now since you won’t brag on yourself I will. You’ve sold billions of dollars of houses, am I correct? That is true. And the book that kick-started it all for you, Rich Dad Pornhub, the best-selling author of Rich Dad Pornhub, Robert Kiyosaki, the guy that kick-started your career, he’s gonna

be here. He’s gonna be here, I’m pumped. of the United States and soon to be the 47th president of these United States, he needed someone to run the companies for him. And so the man that runs the Trump organization

for Donald J. Trump, as he was the 45th president of the United States, and now the 47th president of the United States is Eric Trump. So Eric Trump is here to talk about time management, promoting from within, marketing, branding, quality control, sales systems,

workflow design, workflow mapping, how to build. I mean everything that you see, the Trump hotels, the Trump golf courses, all their products, the man who manages billions of dollars of real estate and thousands of employees is here to teach us how to do it. You are talking about one of the greatest brands on the planet from a business standpoint. I mean, who else has been able to create a brand like the Trump brand? I mean, look at it. And this is the man behind the business for the last, pretty much since 2015.

He’s been the man behind it. So you’re talking, we’re into nine going into 10 years of him running it. And we get to tap into that knowledge. That’s going to be amazing. Now think about this for a second. Would you, would you buy a ticket just to see a Robert Kiyosaki? We get to tap into that knowledge. That’s going to be amazing. Now think about this for a second.

Would you buy a ticket just to see Robert Kiyosaki and Eric Trump? Of course you would. Of course you would. But we’re also going to be joined by Sean Baker. This is the bestselling author, the guy who invented the carnivore diet. Oh yeah.

Dr. Sean Baker. He’s been on Joe Rogan multiple times. He’s going to be joining us. So you’ve got Robert Kiyosaki, the best-selling author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad, Eric Trump, Sean Baker. The lineup continues to grow, and this is how we do our tickets here at the Thrive Time Show.

If you want to get a VIP ticket, you can absolutely do it. It’s $500 for a VIP ticket. We’ve always done it that way. Now, if you want to take a general admission ticket, it’s $250 or whatever price you want to pay. And the reason why I do that, and the reason why we do that is because we want to make our events affordable for everybody.

I grew up without money. I totally understand what it’s like to be in a tight spot. So if you want to attend, it’s $250 or whatever price you want to pay. That’s how I do it and it’s $500 for a VIP ticket now We only have limited seating here with them the most people we’ve ever had in this building was for the Jim Brewer

Presentation Jim Brewer came here that the legendary comedian Jim Brewer came to Tulsa and we had 419 people that were here 419 people yeah, and I thought to myself, but there’s more room. I felt kind of bad that a couple people had VIP seats in the men’s restroom. Oh no, I’m just kidding. But I thought, so I thought, you know what, we should probably add on. So we’re adding on what we call the upper deck. Or the top shelf. So the seats are very close to the presenters but we’re actually building right now we’re adding on to the facility to make room to accommodate another 30 attendees or more. So again if you want to get

tickets for this event all you have to do is go to thrive timeshow.com go to thrive timeshow.com when you go to thrive timeshow.comcom, go to ThriveTimeShow.com, when you go to ThriveTimeShow.com you’ll go there, you’ll request a ticket, boom. Or if you want to text me, if you want a little bit faster service, you say, I want you to call me right now, just text my number, that’s my cell phone number, my personal cell phone number, we’ll keep that private between you, between you, me, everybody. We’ll keep that private. And anybody, don’t share that with anybody except for everybody.

That’s my private cell phone number. It’s 918-851-0102, 918-851-0102. I know we have a lot of Spanish speaking people that attend these conferences. And so to be bilingually sensitive, my cell phone number is 918-851-0102.

That is not actually bilingual, that’s just saying Juan for a Juan. It’s not the same thing. I think you’re attacking me. Now, let’s talk about this. Now, what kind of stuff will you learn at the Thrive Time Show workshop? So Aaron, you’ve been to many of these over the past seven, eight years. So let’s talk about it. I’ll tee up the thing and then you tell me what you’re going to learn here. Okay. Okay. You’re going to learn marketing, marketing and branding. What

are we going to learn about marketing and branding? Oh yeah. We’re going to dive into, you know, so many people say, Oh, you know, I got to get my brand known out there like the Trump brand. You want to get that brand out there. It’s like, how do I actually make people know what my business is and make it a household name? You’re going to learn some intricacies of how you can do that. You’re going to learn sales. So many people struggle to sell something.

This just in, your business will go to hell if you can’t sell, so we’re going to teach you sales. We’re going to teach you search engine optimization, how to come up top in the search engine results. We’re going to teach you how to manage people. Aaron, you have managed, no exaggeration, hundreds of people throughout your career and thousands of contractors and most people struggle with managing people.

Why does everybody have to learn how to manage people? Well, because first of all, people are, you either have great people or you have people who suck. And so it can be a challenge, you know, learning how to work with a large group of people and get everybody pulling in the same direction can be a challenge. But if you have the right systems, you have the right processes, and you’re really good

at selecting great ones, and we have a process we teach about how to find great people. When you start with the people who have a great attitude, they’re teachable, they’re driven, all of those things, then, you know, you can get those people all pulling in the same direction. So we’re going to teach you branding, marketing, sales, search engine, optimization. We’re going to teach you accounting. We’re going to teach you personal finance, how to manage your finance.

We’re going to teach you time management. How do you manage your time? How do you how do you how do you get more done during a typical day? How do you build an organization? If you’re not organized? How do you do? How do you do organization? How do you build an org chart? Everything that you need to know to start and grow a business will be taught during this two day interactive business

workshop. Now let me tell you how the format is set up here. And again, folks, this is a two day interactive 15, think about this folks, it’s two days, each day it starts at 7 a.m. and it goes until 5 p.m. So from 7 a.m. to 5 p.m. two days, it’s a two day interactive workshop.

The way we do it is we do a 30 minute teaching session and then we break for 15 minutes for a question and answer session. So Aaron, what kind of great stuff happens during that 15 minute question and answer session after every teaching session?

I actually think it’s the best part about the workshops because here’s what happens. I’ve been to lots of these things over the years. I’ve paid many thousands of these things over the years. I’ve paid many thousands of dollars to go to them. And you go in there and they talk in vague generalities, and they’re constantly upselling you for something trying to get you to buy this thing or that thing

or this program or this membership. And you don’t you leave not getting your very specific questions answered about your business or your employees or what you’re doing on your marketing. And what’s awesome about this is we literally answer every single question that any person asks. And it’s very specific to what your business is. And what we do is we allow you as the attendee

to write your questions on the whiteboard. And then we literally, as you mentioned, we answer every single question on the whiteboard. And then we take a 15 minute break to stretch and to make it entertaining when you’re stretching. This is a true story. When you get up and stretch, you’ll be greeted by mariachis. There’s going to probably be alpaca here, llamas, helicopter rides, a coffee bar, a snow cone.

I mean, there’s just… You had a crocodile one time. That was pretty interesting. You know, I should write that down. Sorry for that one guy that we lost. The crocodile, we duct taped its face.

Right? We duct taped… It was a baby crocodile. And we duct tape. No, it was a baby crocodile. And we duct tape. Yeah, duct tape around the mouth so it didn’t bite anybody. But it was really cool passing that thing around and petting it. I should do that.

We have a small petting zoo that will be assembled. It’s going to be great. And then you’re in the company of hundreds of entrepreneurs. So there’s not a lot of people in America today. In fact, there’s less than 10 million people today, according to US Debt Clock, that identify as being self-employed.

So if you have a country with 350 million people, that means you have less than 3% of our population that’s even self-employed. So you only have three out of every 100 people in America that are self-employed to begin with. And when Inc Magazine reports that 96%

of businesses fail by default, by default, you have a one out of a thousand chance of succeeding in the game of business. But yet the average client that you and I work with, we can typically double this. I’m just, no, no, no hyperbole, no exaggeration. I have thousands

of testimonials to back this up. We have thousands of testimonials to back it up. But when you work with a home builder, when I work with a business owner, we can typically double the size of the company within 24 months. And you say double? Yeah, there’s businesses that we have tripled. There’s businesses we’ve grown 8x. There’s so many examples you can see at Thrivetimeshow.com. But again, this is the most interactive best business workshop on the planet.

This is objectively the highest rated and most reviewed business workshop on the planet. And then you add to that Robert Kiyosaki, the bestselling author of Rich Dad Poor Dad, you add to that Eric Kiyosaki, the best-selling author of Rich Dad Poor Dad. You add to that Eric Trump, the man that runs the Trump Organization. You add to that Sean Baker.

Now you might say, but Clay, is there more? I need more. Well, okay, Tom Wheelwright is the wealth strategist for Robert Kiyosaki. So people say, Robert Kiyosaki, who’s his financial wealth advisor? Who’s the guy who manages? Who’s his wealth strategist?

His wealth strategist, Tom Will Wright, will be here. And you say, Clay, I still, I’m not going to get a ticket unless you give me more. OK, fine. We’re going to serve you the same meal both days true story. We have we cater in the food and because I keep it simple. I literally bring in the same food both days for lunch. It’s Ted S. Cozido’s an incredible a Mexican restaurant That’s gonna happen and Jill Donovan good friend, who is the founder of

Rustic Cuff. She started that company in her home, and now she sells millions of dollars of apparel and products. That’s rusticcuff.com. And someone says, I want more. This is not enough. Give me more. Okay, I’m not gonna mention their names right now, because I’m working on it behind the scenes here. But we’ve got one guy who’s given me a verbal to be here. And this is a guy who’s one of the wealthiest people in Oklahoma. And nobody really knows who he is because he’s built systems that are very utilitarian that offer a lot of value. He’s made a lot of money in the it’s the it’s

where you rent. It’s short. it’s where you rent it’s short not it’s where you’re renting storage spaces he’s a storage space guy he owns the what do you call that the rental the uh storage space storage units this guy owns storage units he owns railroad cars he owns a lot of assets that make money on a daily basis But they’re not like customer facing most people don’t know who owns the mini storage facility or most people don’t know who owns the Warehouse that’s passively making money. Most people don’t know who owns the railroad cars, but this guy he’s giving me a verbal that he will

Be here and we just continue to add more and more success stories. So if you’re out there today and you want to change your life, you want to give yourself a incredible gift, you want a life-changing experience, you want to learn how to start and grow a company,

go to thrivetimeshow.com. Go there right now, thrivetimeshow.com. Request a ticket for the two-day interactive event. Again, the day here is March 6th and 7th. March 6th and 7th. We just got confirmation.

Robert Kiyosaki, best-selling author of Rich Dad, Poor Dad. He’ll be here. Eric Trump, the man who leads the Trump organization. It’s going to be a blasty blast. There’s no upsells. Aaron, I could not be more excited about this event. I think it is incredible and there’s somebody out there right now you’re watching and you’re

like but I already signed up for this incredible other program called Smoke Your Way to Thin. You think that’s going to change your life? I promise you this will be 10 times better than that. Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking. Don’t do the smoke your way to thin conference. That is, I’ve tried it, don’t do it. Chain smoking is not a viable, I mean it is life changing.

It is life changing. If you become a chain smoker it is life changing. It’s not the best weight loss program though. Right, not really. So if you’re looking to have life-changing results in a way that won’t cause you to have a stoma, get your tickets at Thrivetimeshow.com.

Again that’s Aaron Antis, I’m Clay Clark, reminding you and inviting you to come out to the two-day interactive Thrivetimes Show workshop right here in Tulsa, Oklahoma. I promise you, it will be a life-changing experience. We can’t wait to see you right here in Tulsa, Oklahoma.

 

Transcribed with Cockatoo