Clay Clark | The Process Of Becoming An Effective Leader With David Robinson + The Pros and Cons of Self-Publishing

Audio Transcription

So many different times in my life, I’ve played with broken or hurt things, broken foot, broken leg, broken hand, broken arm, broken sternum, broken collarbone. I could keep going if I just thought more about bones. Why, man? Because I loved it. I loved playing the game. I was passionate about it. One of the reasons I even get encouraged at seeing all of you here, you know why I get encouraged by that is because you could be anywhere doing a lot of different things, but you chose to be here Some shows don’t need a celebrity narrator to introduce the show But this show does in a world filled with endless opportunities Why would two men who have built 13 multi-million dollar businesses? five hours per day to teach you the best practice business systems and moves that you can use. Because they believe in you and they have a lot of time on their hands. This started from the bottom, now they’re here. It’s the Thrive Time Show starring the former U.S. Small Business Administration’s Entrepreneur of the Year, Clay Clark, and the entrepreneur trapped inside an optometrist’s body. Dr. Robert Zurnack. Two men, eight kids, co-created by two different women. Thirteen multi-million dollar businesses. We started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, and I’ll show you how to get here. Started from the bottom, now we’re here. We started from the bottom, now we’re here to climb Started from the bottom, now we’re at the top Teaching people systems to get what we got Colton Dixon’s on the hoops, I break down the books She’s bringing some wisdom and the good looks As the father of five, that’s why I’m alive So if you see my wife and kids, please tell them hi It’s the C and T up on your radio And now 3, 2, 1, here we go! We started from the bottom, now we’re here to climb Started from the bottom, let me show you how to get this David Robinson, how are you sir? Glenn, good to see you today. Hey, you too. We’re here today talking about the process of becoming an effective leader. I say an effective leader. I think a lot of people, we’re the boss of the company. There’s 10 people that work with us, and so we’re kind of by default the leader. But maybe no one’s following us. Maybe they’re tolerating us. So we want to become an effective leader. That happens too often. David, do you believe that effective leadership can be learned? Oh, absolutely. There’s no question. I mean, most of us are thrown into leadership positions by default. But that doesn’t mean we’re effective. But yeah, I do believe that most of us can become effective if we learn certain strategies. We all have different talents. We all have different strengths. But I think if you are perceptive, you understand what you’re good at, what you’re not good at, you can certainly become effective. Well, here’s an example, I think, of somebody who became an effective leader. You went to college and you were six foot six in your freshman year? About six, seven and a half. Six, seven and a half your freshman year of college there at the Naval Academy. And you grew to be seven foot one by what, the end of your sophomore year? Yeah, I was six, seven and a half with a day I reported about 172 pounds. And by the time I was into my sophomore year, I was seven foot and 235. So I had gained 60 pounds in the first two years I was there. So you’re now, you know, all of a sudden you went from a guy who was a good athlete. I think admittedly you’d said in high school you were okay. I was just okay. And you were, you know, in high school, six foot five, what, six foot six player your junior and senior year? Right, six four about my junior year, and about six seven my senior year. So you were good, but you weren’t like the best in the world. Right, I had some college coaches actually come and watch me play and say that they didn’t think I was good enough to play Division I basketball. So then you get to the Naval Academy, where I think there’s a long history of players who’ve gone from the Naval Academy to the pros. There’s you, and then there’s you, and then it’s pretty much you. And so you’re there, and all of a sudden you become like the superstar. I think your senior year, what did you score, 28 points a game your senior year in college? Something like that. It was a lot. You didn’t count, but I was looking it up. So you were scoring a lot of points. So all of a sudden you went from one of the guys to like the V guy. And now you get drafted, and you’re kind of supposed to be the chosen one who’s going to save the Spurs or fix the team or help. Perfect example of someone who is thrust into leadership. Okay, and so you’re all of a sudden. I had no choice on that one. So let’s talk about it. When the other Spurs, you know, start showing up and you know, they’ve been there for a few years. Right. And you’re the new guy. And they start showing up for practice. And what was that like trying to learn to be a leader on the pro level. Yeah, very difficult. I guess I would imagine for many business guys that come to a new company and you’re supposed to be taking over a vice president job or something, I imagine it’s pretty much the same thing. You’re walking in a little bit cold and there are some more veteran people there who know the system, who know the league, and yet I’m expected to come in and help guide the ship. Very challenging, absolutely. But I think the thing is, is you have to understand your own skills and your own talents. I think part of it was, I had a fairly decent sense of who I was, and I knew that I couldn’t lead in a way that wasn’t comfortable for me. And so I didn’t try to be something that I wasn’t. I just came in, and there was a certain culture here in the team and I said, well, that’s not a culture that I’m comfortable in and I think we need to build around a new culture. Did you actually address the music situation in the locker room? Did you ever say that? Do you remember talking about that? Oh, yeah, many times. Really? Yeah, I addressed a lot of things. I mean, I was probably a little bit obnoxious in some of the things I did. I talked to my coach about saying a bad word or two. I’d say, I don’t mind you yelling at me. Just, you’re just telling me what I need to do. You don’t need to say a bad word to me. But, and so those are things that just, I was a little bit, I wasn’t afraid of anything. I just felt like I want to be what you need me to be, but I can’t be something that I’m not. So my whole thing was either you accept me, you want me, or you don’t, or you want somebody else. And so I tried to bring my talents to the table where I could be most helpful for the team. Now, one of your favorite historical figures, the guy that you named the school after that you started. So we want to make sure we’re, the first venture that you poured your time and energy to after retiring was the Carver Academy. In this school, if you’re not familiar with it, I encourage you to Google it and check it out. Today, the organization is opening how many schools? We’re opening 20 schools here in San Antonio over the next five years. So you started it with nothing. It’s now opening 20-something schools. It’s doing great. But the thing was that you named the school after this guy. So this guy’s name has value. This guy’s name has meaning. It means something to you. He said this, 99% of the failures come from people who have the habit of making excuses. Do you believe that a leader can ever make excuses? No, because nobody cares about excuses. You know, excuses are reasons why you didn’t get there. You know, you just, you need to know why you didn’t get there, but you can’t use them as an escape. You need to use that information in a way that can help you grow in the future. Failure is not the end of the world. I don’t think that, you know, we look at failure as something to avoid at all costs, and I think that that’s a mistake. I think we need to embrace failure sometimes. Sometimes we need to know what our boundaries are. We need to know what we can and what we cannot do. There are areas where I know I’m not strong. And I would hate to push forward in an area where I think I’m good and I’m not. So I think sometimes we need to know when we fail. I need to get somebody to help me in this area. So when you started the Carver Academy and the private school, you really wanted to empower the kids with a great education and discipline. And you stressed a lot that a leader listens, responds, and supports others. So I want to talk about this principle one, he listens. In your mind, what does it mean for a leader to really listen? Not just to sit there and wait for someone to finish talking, but to actually listen. What does that mean for a leader to listen? Well, probably the best example I can use of that is in a marriage. As a husband, you’re the leader of the household. You’re responsible for the outcome of that family. To listen means to hear what your partner is saying. So it doesn’t always mean that you do what they say, but it means that you hear it and you respond to it and understand that that person is trying to help you get to where you want to be. I mean that that person is your partner, your other half. You know the two become one. And so listening means hearing what they have to say and respecting what they have to say and understanding that it is it is that’s your other half that’s coming from you and you need to weigh it accordingly. So I think listening is a really critical skill that sometimes we glaze, we gloss over. We’re not even, I know a leader of a huge organization that told me, he said, I wasn’t very good at listening before. He said, I always interrupted people when they spoke because I thought I knew exactly what they were getting ready to say. And he said, when the meeting would end, I would give all of my suggestions and everybody would leave. And he said, I didn’t listen to what they were saying. But he said, I’ve taken a step back. And now I, before I even give any of my suggestions after the meeting, I listen to everyone. And he says, usually most of the items on my list are ticked off and I may have one or two things to add, but other people feel like they’re a part of the conversation now. They feel like they’re contributing to the meeting, contributing to the organization, and we still get the same amount of work done. So listening is a skill. It’s making other people feel valued in their opinion. That’s an action step that we can all take, not trying to fill in the words for people, and to make sure that if you’re in an office environment, go ahead and let everybody share their input before you share yours. Well, at least listen. I mean, you know, if you respect them, if you have them in a position where they have a job to do, listen to what they’re saying. That is a key aspect to getting them to have some buy-in to what your company or what your organization is doing. Now, throughout your career, you’ve had to learn to be a good listener. Has there been, this gentleman you were talking about there, has there been certain people that have taught you this skill? Have you had people that you’ve kind of observed and said, wow, that person is a great listener. That’s somebody that I learned from. Well, I mean, I think the people that I love the most, my family are probably the ones that have taught me the most about listening. I pay a price when I don’t listen to them. And it’s not fun. It can be discord in a relationship, or it can be rebellion. I mean, it can be anything. So there’s a heavy price to be paid when you ignore someone who is important to you and to your group, to your organization. I just think that that’s a valuable lesson that you can learn the hard way, or you can learn through either mentorship, or you can learn just by listening and saying, hey, okay, I’m gonna try that. I’m gonna sit down, I’m gonna hear what they have to say. And even sometimes, even if I don’t agree with it, I’m gonna go ahead and go along with it, just to see, just to show them that they’re important to me. Give them some ownership in the family. It’s not just my family, it’s our family. So yeah, sometimes it pays to even go against what you might think to support those people around you. Now principle number two is he responds. When you say that a leader responds, what does that mean? Well responding is not letting something go by the wayside. If there is a problem or a perceived problem, it doesn’t have to be a real problem. Sometimes it has to be just something someone thinks. Again, going back to the family analogy, if my wife thinks there’s a problem, then there’s a problem. Whether there is or not, there’s a problem. So understanding, you listen and you respond to the problem. You respond to the issue and say, I recognize what you’re saying and let’s figure out some next steps to take. So these are principles we can apply in any business, any form of leadership. We can listen, we can respond. Can you give an example of how maybe, you’ve had some great leaders in your life. I mean, you had a chance to play on the Dream Team there with Coach Daly. I know you’ve had some great leadership at the Naval Academy. You’ve had great leadership on the NBA level. Can you think of a good example of one of the leaders that you’ve seen who responded really well? I mean, he was absolutely dynamite when it came to responding to things he heard. Yeah, I would go back to my time with the Spurs, and I would say that Greg Popovich is a really great example of that. Greg Popovich was our coach there, and he led us to several championships, now four championships and counting. And he was, when he first came in, he had his ideas of how things should go, and he had his plan he put into place, but over the years I’ve seen him adapt to different players, different styles, different input and opinion. And now he’s very much a players coach. He still has his vision, he still has his system, but does a phenomenal job of really adapting his system to the players that he has. And so he is a coach that has done a very good job of listening to his players and responding to their needs. As I got older, he played me less, no matter what I said. I was like, I want to play more, I want to play more. He said, no, we’re going to cut your minutes back. We’re going to prepare you so you can be effective in the playoffs. Well, you know, he’s a guy that responded to, you know, the circumstances, not only what he heard, but what he saw. Sometimes listening is observing, you know, it’s seeing what’s happening in your environment, what’s happening in my family, what’s happening on the job. I see that you’re struggling with this. I see that you’re tired when you come into work. I see that something, so I need to respond to those sort of things. So that’s a good example though, of here you were in your career, you didn’t want to reduce your minutes, but he listened to you, right? You guys had a discussion. And then you expressed your concerns, and even though maybe you two didn’t agree, he went ahead and said, hey, so we can win some championships which we can both agree on here. I’m going to go ahead and make a decision after hearing you out to do this. I’m going to respond and make this, even though you didn’t necessarily agree with the decision at that time, were you ultimately thankful that he did it that way? Oh, absolutely. You know, my body was fresher and I was able to contribute in good ways in the playoffs in that time. And so, you know, I think that right or wrong, he was trying to be sensitive to me. And it’s hard to be mad at somebody who’s trying to be sensitive to you, who’s trying to help you be a better player, who’s trying to put you in a position where you can succeed. He was trying to do that for me. So at the end of the day, I had to appreciate that part. Now, the final thing is a leader, he supports others. So he supports others. So what do you mean when you say that a leader supports others? What does that mean? Well, you want the best for someone, even more so than they even want for themselves at times. And the best example for that would probably be the father-son relationship or the father-child relationship. Sometimes you restrict or you will limit or you will do something for your children because it’s in their best interest. You want something better for them than they even want for themselves. They wanna go out, they wanna have a good time. They want to do this and they want to do that. And you say, no, I’m going to make sure that you stay home and study this time. As a leader, I’m looking out for them. I’m supporting them because I, as the leader, presumably I know a little bit more about the overall plans and what’s happening. And I’m going to put you in a position where you can succeed. So if you’re a business owner watching this right now, what I’m getting out of this is one, we want to listen. We want to not just talk over our staff or finish their sentences for them or make them feel like we already know what they’re gonna say. Right. Or making them feel like their opinions aren’t valuable. They are very valuable. You may not agree with them, they may not be useful at the time, but their opinions are valuable. And if we didn’t value their opinion, maybe they shouldn’t be our employee if we truly didn’t I mean it’s kind of responsibility to listen to that Absolutely, then the second is we want to respond so once we hear what they said we need to respond Based upon that and finally we support other people we support them, and we really get in there, and we We show we look into their lives. We try to figure out. What are your dreams? Where are you where do you want to go at the Carver Academy? We looked at our teachers, and we said what do you want to accomplish? How can we help you accomplish those things? Can we help you continue in education? How can we help you be a better teacher? And we tried to support them in many different ways. And if they wanted to leave, then we would support them in that. Of course, we wanted them to be there, and especially if we put the training and the time in there, we wanted them to be a part of our organization, but at the same time, my interest is your well-being. Now, David, I think this is, hearing this, to me it’s more inspiring than ever that anybody can be a great leader. But I think we have to look in the mirror and ask ourselves, are we a great leader? And if we are, are we a great leader? And if we’re not, we need to probably go back to these three principles and make sure that we apply them. There is a book that I wanted to make sure I’m not getting the title wrong here, but it’s called the man who talks with flowers Right. Okay. That’s a great book about George Washington Carver and it really just talks about his life and his is his perspective on growing up On appreciating what nature had to offer and utilizing his talents for good. Awesome. Well, Dave I I appreciate you for being a guy who’s not only been a great leader on the court, but you’ve actually grown up a whole flock, if you will, of leaders. It seems like there’s been hundreds and hundreds of kids who’ve gone to school there now. Yes. How many years has the school been around? Twelve years now. And how many kids have gone through? Probably about 130 or 140 kids have gone through the process there. So we’ve had two graduating classes going into college now. So that’s amazing. And have you started to get some letters or some kind of follow up to see where these kids are? I get lots of feedback, absolutely. And I see kids getting scholarship. A couple of kids I saw last year got athletic scholarships. One for basketball, one for lacrosse. I saw quite a few kids that are getting academic scholarships. So it’s a lot of fun for me to follow these guys and to see their motivation go on and continue as they go through high school and college now. Well thank you for being a guy who’s raising a generation of leaders. I appreciate it very much. My pleasure. Thank you so much. Thanks Clay. All right Thrivers, we are back. We’re talking about self-publishing again. A lot of Thrivers, they’ve been asking, hey, should I self-publish? Should I not self-publish? I’m an author and I want to get my book out into the marketplace. What is this whole world about self-publishing? We have our Thriver of the Month, John Tucker here. John, thank you for joining us. Thank you for having me. We have Clay Clark, somebody who has self-published before. He’s going to walk us through a little bit more of the specifics, the pros and the cons of self-publishing. Clay, let’s go ahead and start with the pros. The pros of self-publishing, really you have just a couple of them. They’re notable. Some might seem a little bit obvious, but I think we need to get a little context here to them. One is you can print them on demand. A very, very good friend of mine who I worked with, he became a best-selling author, a New York Times bestseller. The problem is his second book did not sell well. Did not sell well at all. And so he went ahead though and bought advanced copies of his book, you know, because you can work out deals with the publishers where you go, hey, I know my book is going to do so well, I’ll go ahead and buy 10,000 copies. Well, first off, what does 10,000 copies look like of something? I mean, he has a whole garage, I’m not kidding, stacked, he still has it, absolutely packed with books. And they’re about six bucks a piece five bucks a piece four dollars a piece the more you buy three two So you’ve got fifty thousand dollars of inventory sitting in your garage So you have fifty thousand dollars of inventory in your garage? the pro of self-publishing is that You can put them on demand a person can click on Amazon buy a book and they’ll make the book When there’s a demand so they don’t print it until there’s a demand. That’s a pretty cool thing The last the second thing is there’s less overhead, like we talked about. So it saves you a massive amount of money by not having to buy all those books up front. And the third is that your profit per book is almost ridiculous. You can print the book for $3 and you can sell them for $15 or $20. I know a lot of really, really good authors that sell very, very small books, 50 bucks, 30 bucks, 20 bucks. This is a conference, and they say, hey, it’s a part of my package. You’re gonna get this three-ring bound binder and my book. The total package is $39. And people will buy it because it has valuable content that they want at their workshops. And they’re printing them for $4. So I mean, the profit’s great. The only thing about it is that if you’re self-publishing, those pros all don’t matter if you can’t sell. It’s probably crude, but I always tell people, if you can’t sell, then your business idea goes to hell. I mean, it’s just, but that’s the kind of the thing. So at the end of the day, all those pros don’t matter if you’re not selling anything. So this is all based off of the construct that you are selling things. So for me, as an author, one of the highlights of my career that was kind of fun is I was at Barnes and Noble and I was there looking for a book on entrepreneurship and as a Pacifica I was looking for one on some internet marketing and I go in there and there’s my book, Make Your Life Epic, my book that I wrote, my kind of journey from startup to being very profitable was there at Barnes and Noble. And what happened is regionally I had sold so many off my ISBN number, it’s like your serial number for your book. They were like, this guy is from Tulsa, he sold a bunch of copies, we’ll start carrying them. And then a buddy who works in our office sent me a text and goes, dude, your book, I just saw it at Borders. And it was just fun to kind of see that. But self-publishing doesn’t really matter. All these pros don’t matter unless you can sell it. And so in our previous trainings together, we’ve talked a lot about how to get it out there. But what questions do you have about those pros? Well, I’m aware of most of those. Is there any big question that you’re kind of going, you know, I don’t quite? No. The pros all come with this one major, major con, which is there’s no guaranteed sales. Exactly. Which takes us into our next. That’s it. Next part here. Okay, so we’re talking about the pros. I just want to recap them for you. We have the printing on demand, okay? So if Thrivers are a little bit more unfamiliar with that, I’m just going to drill into that just a little bit more. You are printing a run of books, and they can be a smaller run of books because you’re printing them on demand. The printer, the public, not the, whoever is printing the books for you. You send them, hey, I need this many books. Kind of an additional con is because you’re dealing with small companies that are helping small authors, a lot of them are cons. Like the wrath of con, no, but like a convict maybe, like a con artist, like, hey, pay me up front for a thousand books and then I move to Detroit. Hey, I mean, so I have a lot of people that I’ve seen over the years who’ve run into some really bad companies as it relates to this. So I would recommend you find a reputable self-publishing option. I would not use… One lady called me. Unbelievable. I was so mad at her. So mad when I found out what was going on. I didn’t pay her, but I was so mad. She called me and said, Clay, we saw you speak at this event. We would love to help you self-publish. My husband, I said, we do? Okay. Yeah, what we’ll do is for $25,000 up front, we’ll set up your book for you. We’ll do this. We’ll get you an Amazon. We’ll get you here. We’ll help you. And I’m just doing some Google searching, and I find that that was her move. And she would call you and coach you into believing that you’re the next big thing. So all these people on Ripoff Report were saying, yeah, she’ll call you and say, your book is profound. It needs to be written. She normally charges $50,000, but she’s only going to charge you $20,000 because she just believes in your deal so much. And for seven payments of $3,000 a month, you can get it. And so you kind of like when people say good things about you, right? So she took advantage of that human desire to feel appreciated and she was running around the country telling people who had won business awards, hey Marshall, I love what you’re doing here for the HR industry. Clay, I love what you’re doing for the Small Business Administration. Hey, I love what you’re talking about with your book about bicycle riding. I love it. So, the world needs that book. And normally I charge $50,000, but for $20,000 I’ll go ahead and you get that a lot in self-publishing. So, Thrivers, if you need recommendations, we can certainly recommend reputable printing services for you. Okay. So, the pros, printing on demand, as needed, printing as needed. The second is less overhead. You don’t have to invest as much as you would if you were going through a big-time publisher. And then the third is you ultimately will have more profit per book because you aren’t paying the publisher. There isn’t a huge investment up front, so you actually make more money on the return. And they’re also notorious for making crappy covers, crappy chapters, spelling errors everywhere. So I’m just saying you have to set the standard. No one cares more about you than you, but you have to really set the standard when dealing with most self-publishing companies. Okay, so those are the pros of self-publishing a book. Okay, so now we’re going to go ahead and get into the cons of self-publishing. Now, Clay, you kind of alluded to some of them in the previous episode here, but let’s get into it. Clay, what are the cons of self-publishing, and why can this kind of be a scary territory, a scary landscape to kind of push yourself into? Well, as I get into it, I’d like to see if you can find the audio clip from the Wrath of Khan, you know, where he yells, Khan! You know, because I feel like after I name each Khan, if we could have Khan! That would just help me get inspired. But, okay. So, the first con, though, is the Wrath of Khan, Star Trek II, is that you have no defined marketing channel or distribution at all. Just no defined deal. And they always, they’ll say whatever, not everyone, but most self-publishers I’ve met, no, it’s, guys, I’m not attacking self-publishing, I’m just saying, you know, most hair stylists are going to go, oh, you look great. You know, most personal trainers are going to go, oh, you’re looking good. I mean, most insurance agents are like, you’re my kind of customer. I mean, there’s a little bit of homerism there, but what they do a lot in self-publishing is they’re going to go, your book really could just fit in tons of categories. I mean, it’s really a mixture between self-help and fitness and mindset and Judeo-Christian, fathering, parenting, husband. I mean, your book is like, really, it’s multi-channel, it’s multi-category. It’s one of the few books that I’ve seen that can transcend all of the categories. And so you’re like, yeah, but you don’t have a defined marketing channel. And good luck selling if you’re not aiming. So it’s kind of like the guy with the rifle who’s not aiming. You might have an awesome rifle and an awesome bullet and your awesome gun, but if you’re not aiming, you’re going to miss. You have to have an aim of some kind. I mean, you just have to do that. Otherwise, it’s really futile. So that’s, do you feel good about knowing what your channel is? I do. Yeah. Yeah, I think I’m zoning in. My target’s getting smaller all the time, so I know exactly what I’m going after. As you write your pitch deck and you make it more and more defined, it’ll get more and more laser focused. And then once it becomes so laser focused that almost nobody wants it, that’s when you’ll sell it Because it’s gonna apply just to the people who are looking for it, right? So that is you gotta when you’re trying to be all things to all people usually very little traction occurs They are Marshall in my to make sense No, absolutely And I think that’s where a lot of the average show not our thrivers not you John But the average show it scares a lot of people is because there is no guaranteed Hey, this is the path to selling the book. It’s all on them. So you’re going to reap the reward of the time investment that you put in. I have a very good friend of mine who is a New York Times bestselling author. He’s sold two books that are New York Times bestselling authors. He got cash advances to write them. And he now made more in the last 36 months off of self-publishing than he’s made off of any of his books combined. So this guy has sold like 300,000 copies of each book-ish. He’s made more off of selling 50,000 self-published, do the math on that. So he’s making like a dollar per book for 600,000 books. Now he’s making like $10 per book off of, I mean, you start to see the value. But if you have a built-in audience and you know how to market, that’s a great thing to have. So that’s kind of the deal there. I mean, Marshall, do you find that audio clip? I don’t know. I’m just lip reading, so I think I have it. Okay, try it real quick. Just see what happens. Let’s see what we got here. I don’t know. Maybe. Oh, yes! Yes! Yes! That right there. See, now I’m more excited about the next con. Con! Just get it right, cued up so we’re ready at any moment just to hammer it home. I know you’re trying to mix and find audio clips while we’re trying to… But that, right, did that do something for you too? That was good. Yeah, that was good. Maybe a little louder next time. Okay, I got it. Okay. Now the second one here we have here, Marshall, go ahead and tee it up for us, my friend. Okay, is no guaranteed revenue. So it’s similarly related as you don’t know what the distribution channel’s going to be, but also you don’t have any guarantees on money coming back into the bank account. So Clay, break this down. Well, this is for entrepreneurs or not entrepreneurs. So many people, they get a job and they say, well what’s my guaranteed pay? I mean, if you’re self-employed, nothing. I wake up every month having no clue what I’m going to make. You know, that’s kind of exciting. I mean, to me it’s exciting because the elephant in the room, our hair cutting business is killing it. Our photography business is growing. The fitness companies I’m working with, you know, I’m the COO of Boot Camp Tulsa. We have a chance to work with the brand called FFR. It’s First Fit Responders, helping them as they train police and fire. I love not knowing what I’m going to make every month because I can make as much as I want. However, somebody says, I’d like to have something I can count on, which is why I highly recommend that every entrepreneur, if you’re going to get into the world of entrepreneurship, you moonlight. You keep your full-time job while you develop traction on your part-time thing. The only time that I see entrepreneurs having huge meltdowns is when they quit their full-time job to start a business and their business has no traction before they quit. You can’t do that. People ask me, Clay, why did you do consulting when you still built Thrive? Because I’m not dumb. Because I’m realistic. Because everything always takes three times longer than you think and it costs five times more. I mean, it always does. So you’ve got to plan on that. I mean, you’re negative. You don’t believe in your idea. You’re not burning the boats. No, I think you are burning your boats when you spend a million dollars on something. I think you are. I think you are burning your boats when you spend every waking moment thinking about something. I think you are burning your boats when you put your name on everything. I think you are burning your boats. I don’t think you’re burning your boats. I think it would be insane, though. I don’t think you want to be in the middle of the ocean just setting your boat on fire going, I burned my boats. Look, I want… They’re like, Greg, we’re going to die. We’re going to die, Greg. Well, I burned my… That’s true. I mean, you don’t want to do that. So you just think about how you want to at least get to land before you burn your boats. Make sense? At least get a little traction there. Is that helpful? Yes. Marshall, do we have that sound clip ready? I just… I just… There we go. Just one more time, because I feel like the way that you played it, it started to take me to that level, but I need just a little more, a little more volume, just a little more, just a little more.” Oh, that’s a con. That’s not what you want. All right. Okay, so then the third one is you against the world. Okay, so Clay, this is a con of self-publishing. What does this mean? Google the word narcissism for a second and pull up that definition, because this is what you’re going to run into. People say there’s no I in team, but there’s an I in narcissism. There are actually a couple of I’s in there. The thing is that you really have to self-promote and be very comfortable with it. You have to become comfortable. I’ll give you an example of me self-promoting. The other day, I was working with a client and they said to me, I’m kind of looking to lease a new office space and I want to talk to you about that. I’m trying to find a space. They don’t know that I own a real estate company. They never asked me. So I said, hey, I highly recommend that you use our company. They said, why? Because we’re the best. We’ll take care of you. We’ll treat you the way I want to be treated. I promise you we’ll treat you the way I want to be treated the entire step of the way. I’ll put my name on it, put my reputation on it. If I screw it up, just tell me. But I mean, we’ll take care of it. I mean, we’ll knock it out. Then a person looks me in the eye and goes, Are you really saying that you’re the best real estate company in Tulsa? I said, Yeah. I mean, I wouldn’t be doing it if I wasn’t. We have the best website. We’ve got the best tools. We have the best, yeah. But I don’t feel uncomfortable about it because again, I believe I do serve a good God who has made a great planet, a great God, excellent God, great planet, and I believe that work is worship. I believe that my quality of my work is people associate it with my religious beliefs. Unfortunately, if I do a crappy, crappy job in every aspect of my life, people assume that I’m a mediocre guy and I serve a mediocre God. So I try to, in every area of my life, try to operate with excellence. I point back and people say, Wow, you’re really good at what you do. I say, No, no. He’s built to give me a certain set of skills and he’s the big shooter. I am just the guy who’s executing. I’m the tool. He’s the master plan. He’s got the blueprint. I’m just the tool. So that’s kind of the mindset. But if you’re not comfortable with self-publishing, or with self-promotion, I mean, self-publishing is not for you. If you’re not comfortable with, seriously, self-promoting, it’s not for you. So, is there any questions that either one of you guys have about that? I just want to make sure we’re… No. I mean, that breaks down the cons of self-publishing and we talked about the pros, talked about the cons. Cons? Cons? Can you just one more time? Just one more time, I’m so sorry. I just, to me it’s… Oh, wow. That was worth it. I’m sorry. I hate to rabbit trail like that, but that, short of watching Star Trek 2 again, that’s all I needed to get me through today. So Thrivers Thank you so much for tuning in about self-publishing the pros and cons John. Thank you for joining us today. Thank you Marshall Thank you for being you well. Thank you for the little sprinkle of other people JT you know what time it is 14 it’s It’s Tivo time and told some baby Tim Tivo is coming to Tulsa, Oklahoma, during the month of Christmas, December 5th and 6th, 2024. Tim Tebow is coming to Tulsa, Oklahoma, and the two-day interactive Thrive Time Show Business Growth Workshop. Yes, folks, put it in your calendar this December, the month of Christmas, December 5th and 6th. Tim Tebow is coming to Tulsa, Oklahoma, and the Thrive Time Show two-day interactive business growth workshop. We’ve been doing business conferences here since 2005. I’ve been hosting business conferences since 2005. What year were you born? 1995. Dude, I’ve been hosting business conferences since you were 10 years old. And a lot of people, you know, they follow Tim Tebow’s football career on the field and off the field. And off the field, the guy’s been just as successful as he has been on the field. Now, the big question is, JT, how does he do it? Well, they’re gonna have to come and find out because I don’t know. Well I’m just saying, Tim Tebow is going to teach us how he organizes his day, how he organizes his life, how he’s proactive with his faith, his family, his finances. He’s gonna walk us through his mindset that he brings into the gym, into business. It is going to be a blasty blast in Tulsa, Russia. Folks, I’m telling you, if you want to learn branding, you want to learn marketing, you want to learn search engine optimization, you want to learn social media marketing, that’s what we teach at the Thrive Time Show two-day interactive workshop. If you want to learn accounting, you want to learn sales systems, you want to learn how to build a linear workflow, you want to learn how to franchise your business, that is what we teach at the two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshop. You know, over the years, we’ve had the opportunity to feature Michael Levine, the PR consultant of choice for Nike, for Prince, for Michael Jackson. We’ve got the top PR consultant in the history of the planet has spoken at the Thrive Time Show workshops. We’ve had Jill Donovan, the founder of rusticcuff.com, a company that creates apparel worn by celebrities all throughout the world. Jill Donovan, the founder of rusticcuff.com, has spoken at the two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshops. We have the guy, we’ve had the man who’s responsible for turning around Harley Davidson, a man by the name of Ken Schmidt. He has spoken at the Thrive Time Show two-day interactive business workshops. Folks, I’m telling you, these events are going to teach you what you need to know to start and grow a successful business. And the way we price the events, the way we do these events, is you can pay $250 for a ticket or whatever price that you can afford. Yes! We’ve designed these events to be affordable for you and we want to see you live and in person at the two-day interactive December 5th and 6th Thrive Time Show Business Workshop. Everything that you need to succeed will be taught at the two-day interactive Thrive Time Show Business Workshop, December 5th and 6th in Tulsa, Oklahoma. And the way we do these events is we teach for 30 minutes, and then we open it up for a question and answer session, so that wonderful people like you can have your questions answered. Yes, we teach for 30 minutes, and then we open it up for a 15-minute question and answer session. It’s interactive. It’s two days. It’s in Tulsa, Oklahoma. We’ve been doing these events since 2005, and I’m telling you, folks, it’s going to blow your mind. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, the Thrive Time Show 2-Day Interactive Business Workshop is America’s highest rated and most reviewed business workshop. See the thousands of video testimonials from real people just like you who have been able to build multi-million dollar companies. Watch those testimonials today at thrivetimeshow.com. Simply by clicking on the testimonials button right there at thrivetimeshow.com, you’re going to see thousands of people just like you who have been able to go from just surviving to thriving. Each and every day we’re going to add more and more speakers to this all-star lineup, but I encourage everybody out there today, get those tickets today. Go to thrivetimeshow.com. Again, that’s thrivetimeshow.com. And some people might be saying, well, how do I do it? I don’t know what I do. How does it work? You just go to thrivetimeshow.com. Let’s go there now. We’re feeling the flow. We’re going to thrivetimeshow.com. Again, you just go to thrivetimeshow.com. You click on the business conferences button, and you click on the request tickets button right there. The way I do our conferences is we tell people it’s $250 to get a ticket or whatever price that you can afford. And the reason why I do that is I grew up without money. JT, you’re in the process of building a super successful company. You started out with a million dollars in the bank account? No, I did not. Nope, did not get any loans, nothing like that, did not get an inheritance from parents, anything like that, I had to work for it. And I’m super grateful I came to a business conference. That’s actually how I met you, met Peter Taunton, I met all these people. So if you’re out there today and you want to come to our workshop, again, you just got to go to Thrivetimeshow.com. You might say, well, who’s speaking? We already covered that. You might say, where is it going to be? It’s going to be in Tulsa, Jerusalem, Oklahoma. And someone says, Tulsa, Jerusalem. I’m really trying to rebrand Tulsa as Tulsa Ruslim, sort of like the Jerusalem of America. But if you type in Thrive Time Show and Jinx, you can get a sneak peek or a look at our office facility. This is what it looks like. This is where you’re headed. It’s going to be a blasty blast. You can look inside, see the facility. We’re going to have hundreds of entrepreneurs here. It is going to be packed. Now, for this particular event, folks, the seating is always limited because my facility isn’t a limitless convention center. You’re coming to my actual home office and so it’s going to be packed. Who? You! You’re going to come. Who? You! I’m talking to you. You can get your tickets right now at thrivetimeshow.com and again you can name your price. We tell people it’s $250 or whatever price you can afford and we do have some select VIP tickets which gives you an access to meet some of the speakers and those sorts of things and those tickets are $500. It’s a two-day interactive business workshop over 20 hours a business training we’re gonna give you a copy of my newest book the millionaires guide to becoming sustainably rich you’re gonna leave with a workbook you’re gonna leave with everything you need to know to start and grow a super successful company it’s practical it’s actionable and it’s Tebow time right here in Tulsa, Russia get those tickets today at thrive timeshow.com again that’s thrive timeshow.com Hello I’m Michael Levine and I’m talking to you right now from the center of Hollywood, California Where I have represented over the last 35 years 58 Academy Award winners 34 Grammy Award winners 43 New York Times bestsellers I’ve represented a lot of major stars And I’ve learned a few things about what makes them work and what makes them not work. Now, why would a man living in Hollywood, California in the beautiful sunny weather of LA come to Tulsa? Because last year I did it and it was damn exciting. Clay Clark has put together an exceptional presentation, really life-changing, and I’m looking forward to seeing you then. I’m Michael Levine. I’ll see you in Tulsa. Thrive Time Show two day interactive business workshops are the world’s highest rated and most reviewed business workshops because we teach you what you need to know to grow. You can learn the proven 13 point business systems that Dr. Zellner and I have used over and over to start and grow successful companies. We get into the specifics, the specific steps on what you need to do to optimize your website. We’re going to teach you how to fix your conversion rate. We’re going to teach you how to do a social media marketing campaign that works. How do you raise capital? How do you get a small business loan? We teach you everything you need to know here during a two-day, 15-hour workshop. It’s all here for you. You work every day in your business, but for two days you can escape and work on your business and build these proven systems so now you can have a successful company that will produce both the time freedom and the financial freedom that you deserve. You’re going to leave energized, motivated, but you’re also going to leave empowered. The reason why I built these workshops is because as an entrepreneur, I always wish that I had this. And because there wasn’t anything like this, I would go to these motivational seminars, and they would never teach me anything It was like you went there, and you paid for the big chocolate Easter Bunny, but inside of it It was a hollow nothingness, and I wanted the knowledge you’re like oh But we’ll teach you the knowledge after our next workshop And the great thing is we have nothing to upsell at every workshop We teach you what you need to know there’s no one in the back of the room trying to sell you some next big get-rich-quick, walk-on-hot-coals product. It’s literally, we teach you the brass tacks, the specific stuff that you need to know to learn how to start and grow a business. I encourage you to not believe what I’m saying, and I want you to Google the Z66 auto auction. I want you to Google elephant in the room. Look at Robert, Zellner, and Associates. Look them up and say, are they successful because they’re geniuses? Or are they successful because they have a proven system? When you do that research, you will discover that the same systems that we use in our own business can be used in your business. Come to Tulsa, book a ticket, and I guarantee you it’s going to be the best business workshop ever. And we’re going to give you your money back if you don’t love it. We’ve built this facility for you, and we’re excited to see it. And now you may be thinking, what does it actually cost to attend an in-person, two-day interactive Thrive Time Show business workshop? Well, good news, the tickets are $250 or whatever price that you can afford. What? Yes, they’re $250 or whatever price you can afford. I grew up without money and I know what it’s like to live without money, so if you’re out there today and you want to attend our in-person, two-day interactive business workshop, all you got to do is go to thrivetimeshow.com to request those tickets. And if you can’t afford $250, we have scholarship pricing available to make it affordable for you. I learned at the Academy at King’s Point in New York, octa non verba. Watch what a person does, not what they say. Good morning, good morning, good morning. Today I’m broadcasting from Phoenix, Arizona, not Scottsdale, Arizona. They’re closed, but they’re completely different worlds. And I have a special guest today. The definition of intelligence is if you agree with me, you’re intelligent. And so this gentleman is very intelligent. I’ve done this show before also, but very seldom do you find somebody who lines up on all counts. And so Mr. Clay Clark is a friend of a good friend, Eric Trump. But we’re also talking about money, bricks, and how screwed up the world can get in a few and a half hour. So Clay Clark is a very intelligent man, and there’s so many ways we could take this thing. But I thought, since you and Eric are close, Trump. What were you saying about what Trump can’t, what Donald, who’s my age, and I can say or cannot say. Well, I have to, first of all, I have to honor you, sir. I want to show you what I did to one of your books here. There’s a guy named Jeremy Thorn, who was my boss at the time. I was 19 years old, working at Faith Highway. I had a job at Applebee’s, Target, and DirecTV. And he said, have you read this book, Rich Dad, Poor Dad? And I said, no. And my father, may he rest in peace, he didn’t know these financial principles. So I started reading all of your books and really devouring your books and I went from being an employee to self-employed to the business owner to the investor and I owe a lot of that to you and I just wanted to take a moment to tell you thank you so much for allowing me to achieve success. And I’ll tell you all about Eric Trump, but I just wanna tell you, thank you sir for changing my life. Well not only that Clay, thank you, but you’ve become an influencer. More than anything else, you’ve evolved into an influencer where your word has more and more power. So that’s why I congratulate you on becoming. Because as you know, there’s a lot of fake influencers out there, or bad influencers. Yeah. Anyway, I’m glad you and I agree so much, and thanks for reading my books. Yeah. That’s the greatest thrill for me today. Not a thrill, but recognition is when people, young men especially, come up and say, I read your book, changed my life, I’m doing this, I’m doing this, I’m doing this. I learned at the Academy in Kings Point in New York, acta non verba. Watch what a person does, not what they say.